| mircea_popescu: | sooo... im just about to finish a humongo batch of 8 worn screens | [08:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | of these i'll be selling one, so let me know what anyone interested is willing to pay. | [08:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | and the rest i'll grind down, so if you're selling bps used in maculature bundles let me know what you want for them. | [08:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | ftr, 5.5 takes 9hours an' a half! | [08:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | omfg wtf server just went down ;/ | [08:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | aaaand there goes an hour heh. | [08:47] |
| diana_coman: | you are not the only one to lose an hour, lol | [09:30] |
| chetty: | well at least such crashes are rare | [09:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | what were you doing diana_coman ? | [09:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | o hey chetty | [09:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | how goes ? | [09:33] |
| diana_coman: | hi chetty, how are you? | [09:33] |
| diana_coman: | just working on the map mircea_popescu, but left at the wrong moment it seems, hence 1 hr it did nothing while I thought it was filling in a bald patch | [09:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | oh oh. | [09:34] |
| diana_coman: | and indeed, it's great that such crashes are really very rare chetty | [09:34] |
| diana_coman: | darned dead molluscs - they are needed in all sorts of ordinaries and I still haven't found them | [09:39] |
| diana_coman: | oh, mircea_popescu you wanted tubers iirc - I have about 1k | [09:39] |
| diana_coman: | around 180q | [09:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | my gin comes out 209. if i make it with tubers at 180 that's 87 * 24 * .29 = 605 coppers sucked out of the samovar. | [09:53] |
| diana_coman: | so dunno, mine them yourself then or what? | [09:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | well, you are levelling sortage right ? | [09:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | i'd like 5-10k at 210+ | [09:55] |
| diana_coman: | I am levelling it up yes, but I did not really prioritize that as you have the highest sortage anyway | [09:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | how about leather ? | [09:55] |
| diana_coman: | (the fastest way to level sortage is anyway through crafting otherwise) | [09:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | ima need more leather at the rate wine's selling out | [09:56] |
| diana_coman: | that (farming) is a fucking nightmare to level up AND it's only through building hence why I want those bloody molluscs | [09:56] |
| diana_coman: | because levelling farming up through small+tiny will take centuries | [09:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | you can have some high q molluscs now that i got sorted out on low q ones | [09:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | for building. you got what to use them in ? | [09:56] |
| diana_coman: | oh yes, I have, let me check the full list | [09:57] |
| diana_coman: | (list of ordinaries I mean) | [09:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | incidentally, what q do you cook at ? | [09:57] |
| diana_coman: | prolly around 155 (that was last time I checked) | [10:00] |
| diana_coman: | due to high tinkering | [10:00] |
| diana_coman: | otherwise gung-ho is 59 | [10:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha | [10:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | incidentally, anyone got a bunch of ibs ? | [10:01] |
| diana_coman: | do you still need tiny/small wwb and wpl as I have 8 small wwb, 4 small wpl, 88 tiny wwb, 60+ tiny wpl | [10:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman this 6th screen is about 90\% done, once it's finished ima look in store for molluscs. how many did you need in the end ? | [10:01] |
| diana_coman: | I have about 500+ ibs around 157 | [10:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | and yes on all altar enums, i am buying | [10:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | how much you want for that ? | [10:02] |
| diana_coman: | 25\% is fine with me no problems | [10:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | so like 200. hm. | [10:02] |
| diana_coman: | so I have 20 ord and each takes 3 molluscs, omg | [10:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | lobbes you know what'd be a kickass functionality, if i could go !r ibs and the bot spit out the recipe. | [10:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | loller! | [10:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | what are these agai n? | [10:03] |
| diana_coman: | lolz mircea_popescu, why don't you just go http://www.dianacoman.com/Eulora/ibs.html | [10:04] |
| diana_coman: | these are in fact ord of ....moss that would boost building alltogether + moss is needed anyway | [10:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | shouldn't a noob build them ? | [10:05] |
| diana_coman: | the farming ordinaries tend to take...canines (my 20+ wwb ordinaries fuck) | [10:05] |
| diana_coman: | well... yes and no; I mean yes for lots of moss, no for high q moss + not losing xp + I need to level up the building anyway to increase q overall for all mining stuff | [10:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | jesus how the fuck am i going to work out this lft line in the end. | [10:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | this shit's too fucking complex. | [10:05] |
| diana_coman: | what's with the ltf line? | [10:06] |
| diana_coman: | btw, I have 40 wm - what do you want to make them into shaped slag for me? (need that for...ordinaries) | [10:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | meanwhile went on a wildly successful mining yest, got 200 shrooms. | [10:07] |
| diana_coman: | with a noob, right? | [10:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | with grenadine yea | [10:08] |
| diana_coman: | well yes, of course | [10:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | sticks + high thread, like 10\% profit. | [10:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | think ima do it again, god forbid we strike an ord should be pretty sweet. | [10:08] |
| diana_coman: | need to search for the line where I said it's noobs that are needed to mine wm and the like (if not everything) | [10:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno, i make it out ok on grass. but i can't get back to it because jesus fuck making screens took 3 days. | [10:08] |
| diana_coman: | I hope maybe mod6 will build some for me on Wed when he gets in to set up the bot | [10:09] |
| diana_coman: | well, basics are a whole different story | [10:09] |
| diana_coman: | comparing grass with wm is... | [10:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's 2 hours / screen for the screen. it's 1 hour for 7 silks + 1 hour for scaffoldings. it's a further 15 minutes each for so (3 of em). etc. ends up like half a day. | [10:09] |
| diana_coman: | well, it lasts a while | [10:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, the story with lft is as follows, let's get into detail maybe a stable definitive solution arises. | [10:09] |
| diana_coman: | tbh I'm running low on some bps to shred | [10:10] |
| diana_coman: | ok, listening | [10:10] |
| diana_coman: | ltf though, lol | [10:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | i burn a lot of ltf in two ways. the low q way is to make IO. no need to go into detail as how needed that is. the high q way is to make gin. no need to explain how much gin i drink on a daily basis. | [10:11] |
| diana_coman: | aha | [10:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | now, i have both high and low goop and thread. so the remainder is ibs. i want low ibs to make high lft | [10:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | i want high ibs + a noob willing to make low lft. | [10:11] |
| diana_coman: | noobs is usually the missing link so far pretty much everywhere, yes | [10:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | and i could even make high ibs if i had low F, becauyse i got some low sr left. | [10:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman the main problem here is that 150ish is neither. | [10:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | you want some more grass ? | [10:13] |
| diana_coman: | basically from what I gather my q is still in the annoying middle wrt yours, pretty much on all fronts | [10:13] |
| diana_coman: | what q? | [10:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno, 200something. | [10:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | like last time. | [10:13] |
| diana_coman: | I guess I'll take it anyway as I'll soon run out of thread at this rate | [10:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | o, btw, you still doing explore fill-in ? | [10:13] |
| diana_coman: | yes | [10:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | so how much cft you got stashed ? | [10:14] |
| diana_coman: | it takes ages, but I have no other idea of how to fill that in | [10:14] |
| diana_coman: | about 4k | [10:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | so that's.... nothing ? | [10:14] |
| diana_coman: | yep | [10:14] |
| diana_coman: | well, it depends on the area | [10:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | back when i was mining i'd go through 10k both each day | [10:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | do you use lbn and cft in about same rate ? | [10:14] |
| diana_coman: | you mined only grass though | [10:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | yea.\ | [10:14] |
| diana_coman: | about so, yes | [10:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok so then, here's the mid term plan : | [10:15] |
| diana_coman: | but as I said: if the area is of some rare stuff, it's much much slower | [10:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | while waiting for me to make lbn, spin all this grass into cft so you're stocked. then buy as much lbn, and go hiot the map. | [10:15] |
| diana_coman: | (on the other hand, there I really hate running out of...lbn as it feels a way larger waste) | [10:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | i hear s.mg will gift you a bubble once yo ugot a filled map published | [10:15] |
| diana_coman: | ha, define filled map | [10:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | (filled map defined as, "each unit coord explored once".) | [10:16] |
| diana_coman: | ahahahaha | [10:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | >D | [10:16] |
| diana_coman: | I'll grow old by then | [10:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | there's only 1mn of them! | [10:16] |
| diana_coman: | and anyway, shouldn't I find the damned bubble if I do that? | [10:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | i thought you were unlucky. | [10:16] |
| diana_coman: | oh, if it is filled as in tried once but possibly found nothing I might end up being just a bit shy of 999 years old rather than fully dead I suppose | [10:16] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, but also stubborn | [10:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah this math doesn't work. how many hits can you do a day, 5k ? | [10:17] |
| diana_coman: | hm, about 40 hoes a night, so 80 hoes a full day say, so that seems under 5k hits, but approx | [10:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman so listen... what'd you pay on 51 molluscs q 438 ? :D | [10:18] |
| diana_coman: | dead or alive molluscs? | [10:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | dead. | [10:19] |
| diana_coman: | 11k each | [10:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | say 600k and they're yours. | [10:20] |
| diana_coman: | ok, works | [10:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | alright. | [10:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | am i getting all this grass out ? | [10:20] |
| diana_coman: | yes, that anyway | [10:20] |
| diana_coman: | how about the wm thing? | [10:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | which wm thing ? | [10:21] |
| diana_coman: | I have 40 wm, what do you want to make shaped slag for me? | [10:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | what q the shrooms ? | [10:21] |
| diana_coman: | around 138 | [10:22] |
| diana_coman: | 27 at 136q and 13 at 140q | [10:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | mmm okay. but the trouble is... i make high oil. you want to make the shaped slag yourself ? | [10:23] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, it's the high q shaped slag I need; so it works better if I make the oil for you or what? | [10:23] |
| diana_coman: | btw 1 000 000 hits/5000 = 200 days | [10:23] |
| diana_coman: | obviously, that's kind of the ideal or something, no connection troubles etc | [10:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | nuts huh. | [10:27] |
| mircea_popescu: | lemme just get all this grass out i'll think something up. | [10:27] |
| diana_coman: | unsurprisingly I got on this job out of my own initiative anyway, lol | [10:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok so lessee. | [10:30] |
| mircea_popescu: | (9999 * 2.42 + 9999 * 2.34 + 9999 * 2.1 + 7165 * 2.29 + 9579 * 2.43 + 8654 * 2.35) * 60 * 1.2 + 600000 = 9860269.92 | [10:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | you're getting a discount for it too! | [10:31] |
| diana_coman: | kk | [10:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | 55395, that almost wipes me out. | [10:33] |
| diana_coman: | yay, molluscs, how they look at me, lol | [10:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [10:34] |
| diana_coman: | kk, got them (and promptly dropped them again) | [10:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok so re the map : | [10:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | suppose you present 3-divisible coords filled. | [10:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | that should make it more reasonable. | [10:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman ^ | [10:40] |
| diana_coman: | by definition anything is more reasonable and ALL coords, true | [10:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | if any other miner wants to do this, we can do 3n+1 and +2 too, so. | [10:40] |
| diana_coman: | I think it took me half a day to really fill in one coord though (due to rares) | [10:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | ye, one line ? | [10:41] |
| diana_coman: | yes | [10:41] |
| diana_coman: | one line from bottom of the map to the top | [10:41] |
| diana_coman: | and now looking at it I did not even bother with some space in the water/possibly out of reach anyway as it would warp | [10:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah. | [10:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | but did you fill it as in, every coord ? or to what fine-ness ? | [10:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | feels a lot like us congress in 1800s, comissioning survey lines towards the west coast. | [10:43] |
| diana_coman: | according to calc, 1000/6 is still 167 days, so better | [10:43] |
| diana_coman: | let me check exactly, my measure was: no white point seen on the plot at all, everything densely coloured | [10:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | wait. what ? | [10:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | also chuckles privately at the memory of "oh, how small this map is" comments. mmmmmyeah :D | [10:44] |
| diana_coman: | lolz, so looking at it in full detail: it's *mostly* covered that line thing: occasionally there are *still* a few coords missing (as in: less than 10 marks in a row on a 10x10 square) | [10:46] |
| diana_coman: | ftr the *only* way to truly control that you hit each and every coordinate as such is to ...teleport | [10:46] |
| diana_coman: | because steps are not that precise | [10:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | but you hit those with sticks no ? | [10:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | did a stick yield a "no result" ? | [10:47] |
| diana_coman: | wait, what? | [10:47] |
| diana_coman: | the whole line with sticks? omg | [10:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | how can you have emprty spots | [10:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | no, just the missing coords. | [10:47] |
| diana_coman: | no, I didn't go through that line on this systematically - the missing spots are still within rares basically (bitterbeans for instance) - so far I used the sticks when there was some small area that would not give anything , not really a precise coordinate | [10:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | wouldn't the scinetific method indicate it's on the contrary, best to murder specific coords ? | [10:50] |
| diana_coman: | perhaps that's why I did not yet find the mollusc/st , maybe | [10:50] |
| diana_coman: | well, the empirical xp doesn't really support that | [10:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | this is a traditional problem of the sm : empirical experience does not support it. hence all the various "alt medicine", parapsichology etc. | [10:50] |
| diana_coman: | I mean yes in theory: but in practice how many times do you need to hit the *very same* coordinate to say it probably holds something more than a stubborn bitterbean you missed? | [10:50] |
| diana_coman: | and keep in mind that going in a line does not really hit the *same* coordinate all the time | [10:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | until it yields. | [10:51] |
| diana_coman: | not precise, no | [10:51] |
| diana_coman: | of the sm? | [10:51] |
| diana_coman: | oh, scientific method | [10:51] |
| diana_coman: | <mircea_popescu> until it yields. <- yes, my point was: not yet enough hits there to say it doesn't yield, at the same time still other places barren that I wanted to fill in first | [10:52] |
| diana_coman: | and how I found the crumbly rock and the pacademia nut in fact | [10:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, your survey contract is : to publish map and data for all (x, y) points where both x and y are divisible by 3, taken from field within a .1 tolerance either direction (so for [18, 21] anywhere in a square between [17.9, 20.9] and [18.1,21.1]), upon which will receive three petrified bubbles, q 100. | [10:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | how about that. | [10:53] |
| diana_coman: | mhm, give me 15-20 minutes to collect the data out of curiosity | [10:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | should be ~11k points, give or take. about 2mn worth of hoe in the ideal case. | [10:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | mmm, add a 0 there, but anyway. | [10:56] |
| diana_coman: | yes, I'm more concerned with the practicality of hitting so precisely | [10:56] |
| diana_coman: | that's why I want to see the data | [10:56] |
| diana_coman: | <mircea_popescu> mmm, add a 0 there, but anyway. <- hahahah | [10:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | mayhap bot will need an update. | [10:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | :D | [10:56] |
| diana_coman: | with what, teleport? | [10:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | no, /pos awareness. | [10:57] |
| diana_coman: | teleport | [10:57] |
| diana_coman: | pos awareness does jack shit | [10:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | why ? | [10:57] |
| diana_coman: | pos awareness is easy | [10:57] |
| diana_coman: | as in: I am at x y z | [10:57] |
| diana_coman: | sure | [10:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway : in the ideal case of perfect robotized processing, doing 5k a day will be 22 days to fill. | [10:57] |
| diana_coman: | however, getting to x y z precisely is the hell | [10:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman so use random walk. "i am at x, should be at x+k, take a step in random direction and see". | [10:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's how bacteria move! | [10:58] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, and see how you spend than double the time just trying to get to the bloody coord | [10:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | :D | [10:58] |
| chetty: | if walking isnt perfectly on grid why would you expect resouces to be perfectly on grid ? | [11:07] |
| diana_coman: | chetty I don't; but if the contract specifies perfectly on grid, then I need to make sure I can deliver that even if it doesn't make practical sense as such (and I don't really think it does - it's just for easy spec of terms imo) | [11:10] |
| chetty: | :) | [11:12] |
| diana_coman: | so running through the data I don't think I'm gonna take that | [11:14] |
| diana_coman: | ftr I even rounded rather than 0.1 | [11:15] |
| diana_coman: | so more like 0.5 either way | [11:15] |
| diana_coman: | on a precision of 0.5 it might be more reasonable | [11:17] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu & | [11:21] |
| diana_coman: | ^ lol | [11:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | so from 17.5 to 18.5 ? | [11:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | while resources aren't probably on grid, what guarantees a whole unit hole isn't enough to actually miss a resource altogether ? | [11:22] |
| diana_coman: | there are no guarantees for anything at all on eulora, are there? | [11:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | ie suppose we're looking at 5,5 10,10. in this square yo go through and hit 5.5, 6.2 and 9.3, 9.5 | [11:23] |
| diana_coman: | thing is: it's not really that much of a hole, it's more a precision thing | [11:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | someone later on comes and hits +1, say 7.8, 7.5 | [11:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | now in that 5.5 to 7.8 space, you could have who knows what we need hidden. | [11:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | how would subsequent effort organize itself ? you have it easy enough now, all you need is grids. but imagine the filling nightmare of later work, when they gotta go inside a random arbitrary lattice. | [11:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | so it's not exactly ease of spec, it's more like you know, usable research. | [11:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | absolute fine-ness, such as 5.000 can be dispensed with, but going all the way to the unit seems a bit much | [11:25] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, so you say that there are resources as rare as being within a 1 unit square basically and nothing else | [11:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | i don't know that there aren't. do you ? | [11:26] |
| diana_coman: | as I said: no guarantees for anything | [11:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | right. gotta build things so they be useful for future generations! | [11:27] |
| diana_coman: | lolz, gotta make sure too that one lives enough to build those things useful for future generations | [11:27] |
| diana_coman: | (not to mention what the hell do you do with points where you get stuck (as in: that covered area in the middle of the map) | [11:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | seems to me chiefly an automation problem. the "ideal bot" would take three weeks or a little more. now, how to get it to go on grid, well... | [11:28] |
| diana_coman: | or those on the slope | [11:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | well obviously inaccessible terrain is inaccessible. | [11:28] |
| diana_coman: | to me it seems more an additional-work-with-unclear-usefulness-other-than-imposed-precision-thing | [11:28] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, how do you class it as inaccessible exactly? how do you basically *prove* it is inaccesible ? | [11:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | i thought i just explained the usefgulness! | [11:29] |
| diana_coman: | "I tried to get there through random walk and I failed " | [11:29] |
| diana_coman: | is that enough to make it inaccesible? | [11:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | suppose you're in 2017 and you get a 10mb set of coords, "these have been explored, now go between them" | [11:29] |
| diana_coman: | well, I'm thick and I didn't get it yet it seems | [11:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | and you have to what, create the graph ? | [11:29] |
| diana_coman: | wait what, you are telling me it is now hard to automate "spit out the missing coordinates from a grid of 1kx1k given this set of explored coordinates"? | [11:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | if exploration snaps to grid, then it's relatively easy to make it denser. if it is random, then it's quite hard. | [11:31] |
| diana_coman: | ok, let's put it this way then: how about precise coordinates then and that's that, so 0,0; 3,3; 6,6 etc | [11:32] |
| diana_coman: | that snaps to grid | [11:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | well that's the idea. precise, with a tolerance of .1 | [11:32] |
| diana_coman: | fuck the tolerance | [11:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | can you actually hit 3.00, 3.00 ? | [11:33] |
| diana_coman: | the 0.1 makes so little difference that ... | [11:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | goes to look at this again. | [11:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | irc .1 was feasible, .2 easy enough | [11:33] |
| diana_coman: | if I aim to hit with tolerance of 0.1 I can aim to hit precisely just as well from my point of view | [11:33] |
| diana_coman: | how did you check that? | [11:34] |
| diana_coman: | ftr even a gentle press on fwd button when walking already moves it 0.2 | [11:35] |
| diana_coman: | this is why I said 0.1 doesn't make much difference from "precise" to me | [11:35] |
| diana_coman: | but then again, I can leave it in as safety net for me, sure | [11:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | hm yeah seems about .25 fine in normal client movement. | [11:40] |
| diana_coman: | .... | [11:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok so how about .3 then ? | [11:40] |
| diana_coman: | that sounds more reasonable | [11:40] |
| diana_coman: | there is still the trouble of how you define points that are inaccessible exactly, as in : how do I prove that x,y is inaccessible? | [11:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha alrighty. | [11:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | you don't have to prove. how do you prove you did the work anyway ? | [11:42] |
| jurov: | you'll be doing it barehanded? my guesstimate comes out as "24k tools worn" | [11:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | as opposed to hooking up a random generator | [11:42] |
| diana_coman: | the points are there to prove that, lol | [11:42] |
| diana_coman: | oh, not in that sense, lolz | [11:42] |
| jurov: | ((800/0.3)^2)/(50000/170) | [11:42] |
| diana_coman: | put another way: when do I give up on a point as inaccesible? | [11:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | jurov nah, it's not every 0.3 | [11:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's every 3 within 0.3 each way, so from 2.7 to 3.3 counts | [11:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman once you can't get there by hand. | [11:43] |
| diana_coman: | you do realise that there were some resources on a slope and jurov said he couldn't get to see what they were at least, but somehow I managed to get there? anyway, I guess that'll be left to "reasonable effort to get there" | [11:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | something like that. | [11:44] |
| jurov: | diana_coman: client does have the map, maybe you can process it directly to get inaccessible parts | [11:45] |
| diana_coman: | I'll first go through my current records and see what's missing | [11:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | incidentally, does teleporting burn you even if you only move a very short distance ? | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | and then will think of something based on that | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | what do you mean "burn"? | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | the answer is no in any case, lol | [11:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | :p | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | or not yet | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | :p | [11:46] |
| jurov: | diana_coman: i instadied when trying to move too fast | [11:46] |
| jurov: | you say teleport was not "fixed"? | [11:47] |
| diana_coman: | I suppose that's specific to moving fast jurov | [11:47] |
| diana_coman: | I guess it will be soon, lol | [11:47] |
| diana_coman: | but for very short distances I'm not sure the server can even be aware | [11:47] |
| diana_coman: | seeing how the client sends the position only at some intervals | [11:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | not that soon, i dun see the problem with precise positioning per se. | [11:47] |
| diana_coman: | and so there has to be some range left | [11:47] |
| diana_coman: | so if I teleport from 0,0 to 3,3 I don't really see why is that a problem | [11:48] |
| jurov: | btw that thing had nothing with exploration, but due to players able to throw stuff farther that max pickup distance, and fact that dropped stuff won't fall | [11:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | the inaccessible bags ? yea. | [11:48] |
| diana_coman: | basically that's when I got teleport back: when my dropped sb ended up on the moon | [11:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | incidentally lobbes the other splendid thing for the bot top have would be a trading module. two things : i want to be able to declare a trade (!s 14543 cft q279 94444 or !b 111 ibs q15 91879 to tell it i bought/sold so and so), and it keeps a db, shows day/week/month prices for resources, allows me to !c 500 ibs q200 (responds with reasonable buy and sell prices based on db) | [11:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | this however is a pretty huge bite. | [11:50] |
| diana_coman: | that'd be grand though | [11:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | mhm. | [11:51] |
| diana_coman: | way more useful than anything else at the moment I'd say | [11:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | too much of a hassle to fish all this from logs as it is, and we're getting at a stage of econ development where i could realy benefit from some macro data. | [11:51] |
| jurov: | btw bot sometimes throws a fit when it ranks up while exploring and heina isn't nearby | [11:53] |
| jurov: | that's new behavior in 1.2 | [11:54] |
| diana_coman: | define "throws a fit" | [11:55] |
| diana_coman: | oh, when exploring? | [11:55] |
| diana_coman: | goes to check code | [11:56] |
| jurov: | it loops "Explore not yet finished nor timedout" | [11:56] |
| jurov: | i have not looked what it was doing when it happened, so am not sure, tho | [11:57] |
| diana_coman: | but what does it have to do with ranking? the explore bot ignores ranking messages | [11:57] |
| diana_coman: | and that is not a loop | [11:57] |
| jurov: | um. then it might have something to with dying | [11:57] |
| diana_coman: | it will go out of that eventually (when timedout) | [11:57] |
| diana_coman: | uhm; did you set a timeout or did you leave it default? | [11:58] |
| jurov: | default | [11:59] |
| diana_coman: | that's 15min iirc so it should continue in 15 minutes | [11:59] |
| diana_coman: | as it's not a loop at a ll | [12:00] |
| diana_coman: | it basically means it did not get for some reason neither the successful /unsuccessful message nor something else to know that the explore finished | [12:00] |
| diana_coman: | hence it waits so that it doesn't mess up your tool | [12:01] |
| diana_coman: | once the timeout expires, it moves on | [12:01] |
| diana_coman: | after going through data once again: the good news is that I have already 24k hits on the desired type of coords; the bad news is that almost half of them are *too* precise | [12:38] |
| diana_coman: | anyway, 24k or rather 13k out of 110 -> lolz | [12:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | what's "too" precise ? | [12:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman | [12:47] |
| diana_coman: | as in 0,0 and then 0.1 0.1 and 0.2 0.2 | [12:52] |
| diana_coman: | while those are 3 points, I'd have to consider them as a single point due to higher precision than required | [12:52] |
| diana_coman: | I guess I can call them redundant | [12:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [13:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | and here i thought .1 is unattainable :D | [13:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | turns out it was accidentally attained 50\% of the time | [13:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | btw mod6 you got any time to dig up diana_coman's moss ? | [13:02] |
| jurov: | diana_coman: succeeded to reproduce it, bot ignores "You cannot explore in the same place twice in a row." messages and waits in vain | [13:13] |
| jurov: | which tends to happen after dying, too | [13:15] |
| jurov: | http://www.explo.yt/eulora/diana_v12_sameplace.diff << easy fix. until evil overlords decide tool is worn in this situation | [13:31] |
| diana_coman: | oh, that yes jurov - didn't really make a comprehensive list of ALL possible messages to receive really- set your timeout properly and that is it | [13:37] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu well, it has been achieved due to my approach of really filling in the areas that I focused on | [13:38] |
| diana_coman: | note though that it is not what you were asking for in the first place | [13:39] |
| diana_coman: | as it's not consistent/full coverage/EVERY point having coverage at 0.1 precision | [13:39] |
| jurov: | welll, i see timeout to be for really unforeseen situations to limit potential damage. this isn't the case. | [13:39] |
| diana_coman: | so then wait the 15 minutes | [13:39] |
| jurov: | tyvm. | [13:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | jurov measure how long your tool takes and use that. | [13:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | so nobody selling any bps ? | [13:49] |
| jurov: | what bps? | [13:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | everything involved in maculature, lemme fish it out | [13:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | hmmm diana_coman no maculature recipe ? | [13:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | jurov : hg, nb, sfh, ft, bct, dg, srs, ibs, cft, s, pcf, mrk, psl, cp, its | [13:53] |
| jurov: | not crafting table? | [13:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | apparently not., | [13:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | is preparing for the megashredding. | [13:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | hanbot 9722 * 465 = 4520730 | [14:06] |
| diana_coman: | I don't really have bps for sale -I'm almost out of some of the key ones myself | [14:06] |
| diana_coman: | yes jurov easy fix for *that* specific message, trouble is that it's not the only message, lol | [14:08] |
| diana_coman: | basically to cover *all* cases in which the explore has finished | [14:08] |
| jurov: | i did not say i want to cover all cases | [14:17] |
| jurov: | just to add *one* know case that bothers me | [14:17] |
| jurov: | you feel you'd open pandora's box or such? | [14:18] |
| diana_coman: | jurov, add it then - that case bothers you , another case will bother someone else etc | [14:22] |
| jurov: | depends. guess what happens if mircea forgets to set timeout and it will start bothering him :) | [14:23] |
| jurov: | would you get into such protracted discussion, soo? | [14:24] |
| jurov: | *too | [14:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | soo... my bct and slag bp stores are now exhausted ;/ | [14:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | aaaand i need more pincered skullcap. anyone has it ? | [14:27] |
| diana_coman: | I have those | [14:33] |
| diana_coman: | jurov check the logs for the answer to your question | [14:33] |
| danielpbarron: | mircea_popescu, i have blueprints listed at http://danielpbarron.com/eulora/shop.txt | [14:35] |
| diana_coman: | but jurov I'll take your point: my mistake for discussing it so much, so I'll keep it short instead - I will collect all and any suggestions/requests and add them to the list at any time; I will do releases only when I plan to do them and with the changes that I decide to include at that time | [14:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | wait, bct at 1750000/15823 = 110.6 ea ? | [14:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | an' 138.6 for slag. hm. | [14:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | ima have to do some math. | [14:37] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu I have 50 pincered skullcap bps at 163 q | [14:42] |
| diana_coman: | and I want to buy 100 braided threads actually , high q | [14:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | i need like... 1k i think heh. | [14:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | will do this 505 run and see what's left once the dust settles. | [14:44] |
| diana_coman: | mhm, high q braided thread -> I'll make more skullcaps as I need them anyway and hopefully more bps, but the loot tends to be not that great really | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | though maybe on 1000 skullcaps run who knows | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | trouble is I'll need 1000 dcs too and I don't have them atm | [14:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah i need dc too | [14:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | i think today will be the highest craft day in history, | [14:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | my maculature is q 4400. | [14:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | base appears 1730. that's then 43 * 505 * 1730 = 37950 worth of overcraft, or 38600 total craft value. | [15:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | dang these screens take a lot of beating. | [17:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | DianaComan you selling any gathering 400 books ? | [18:17] |
| DianaComan: | I think daniel got that, didn't he? | [18:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | o he did ? | [18:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | yo danielpbarron ? | [18:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | im definitely getting book 400 over here. | [18:18] |
| danielpbarron: | i have blueprints | [18:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | so how much for a dozen ? | [18:19] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't have that many | [18:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | hm. well ? | [18:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | a coupla ? | [18:19] |
| danielpbarron: | how much to use a screen? | [18:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | i am actually selling one. | [18:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | you want it ? | [18:21] |
| danielpbarron: | how much / what quality | [18:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | 150\% im thinking | [18:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | like 700k qual | [18:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | tho you can have a work down one if you prefer, since im wearing them | [18:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | this one i've been working on is 220k durabilit. | [18:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | the max ones are 680.9 / 681.change | [18:24] |
| danielpbarron: | ya i'll take one; also interested in some supplication drafts: a few of each leather, berries, snails, stones, thorns, moss | [18:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | you'll have to talk to grenadine about those. | [18:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway. getting back to the gathering book! | [18:57] |
| danielpbarron: | it needs some ingredients i've never heard of | [19:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | what's it take then ? | [19:04] |
| danielpbarron: | rastrums, pigments | [19:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | i got some pigments, actually. | [19:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | foxy you ever got around to making rostrums ? | [19:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron so how much for a coupla books then ? | [19:05] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't know yet | [19:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | mmm | [19:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | so how do you find out ? | [19:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | i'd rather book level my gathering to 400 and use tools after. | [19:06] |
| danielpbarron: | does the quality of the book matter? | [19:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | i have no idea | [19:07] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll have to see how much all the ingredients cost | [19:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | what are they, rostrum, pigment what else ? | [19:09] |
| danielpbarron: | 5 pulps, 11 rastrums, 3 pigments | [19:10] |
| danielpbarron: | i want highest quality on these | [19:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | a, pulps i got, q 190ish | [19:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | pigments ima have to check | [19:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | looks like 8k or so base | [19:13] |
| danielpbarron: | can you make higher quality? | [19:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | prolly ~ 200 of it yeah. | [19:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | ironically i can't really make high enough qual to loot bps anyway, so i guess the right way here would be for you to make a bunch of books. | [19:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | i'd be game for ~100 books, can definitely feed you 500 pulp / 300 pigment. | [19:15] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah i'm gonna overcraft it as much as possible | [19:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | i guess it comes down to whether foxy can fill a 1100 rastrum order. | [19:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | DianaComan you around ? | [19:16] |
| danielpbarron: | what is the advantage to having higher gathering rank? | [19:17] |
| danielpbarron: | i had the highest and DianaComan still made higher quality enums than me | [19:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | i imagine it must help gathering. | [19:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | hm | [19:18] |
| danielpbarron: | i get about the same \% hits as you describe with shiny rock | [19:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | well ok buyt the devil's in that about | [19:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | so i'm getting ~27.8k lbn q 196+ from one full tool. | [19:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | im therefore selling lbn @ 52c each, if anyone wants them lemme know. | [19:47] |
| hanbot: | mircea_popescu tally me fo' 20k please | [19:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | you got it. | [19:51] |
| hanbot: | do we have something like a bathtub so i can swim around in them? | [19:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [19:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | i guess the samovar... | [19:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | hanbot ready for pickup. | [22:37] |
| hanbot: | fantastic 1 sec | [22:37] |
| hanbot: | ahh ty. | [22:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | so aforementioned 505 clicks run yielded.... one single 0.01 btc pop | [22:46] |
| hanbot: | stingy eh? | [22:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | also, 788 delight supps, q 195, 340 rock supps, q 195, 185 lists supps, 59 sparks supps, 948 chicken supps, 2540 vellum conceptions, 25574 shredding instructions. | [22:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | altogether this would be worth (base value) about | [22:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | 27552706.35 | [22:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | so a 27\% loss over the 37950 overcraft value. | [22:56] |
| hanbot: | wow | [22:56] |
| hanbot: | very nice supps, but.... | [22:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | or in other words i'd have to sell the bps resulting at 136\% to break even | [22:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | course , 7.5mn of that was shredding supps which i mostly... shredded, but anyway. | [22:57] |
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