#ossasepia Logs for 19 Nov 2019

April 21st, 2020 by Diana Coman
diana_coman: http://younghands.club/2019/11/18/rmd-review-nov-11th-nov-17th/#comment-136 - speaking of foreign languages, if that's English article, than I'm talking Romanian here; dorion why not say something there? lol [08:57]
diana_coman: I do this at times and end up speaking not-the-language-I-thought so just ...say something. [08:58]
dorion: diana_coman I paused and let myself go to something else when I ran into that. I don't know exactly why, but will be sure to speak up moving forward. [09:07]
diana_coman: well, if you don't, I can tell you (from experience) that one day I'll throw a block of ro-text at you and then be all surprised you don't get it already, lolz [09:09]
dorion: lolz, I would like to get to the point that I do get it already, but without the surprise on your side. [09:11]
diana_coman: whaack: how's it going today? [15:51]
whaack: diana_coman: good, i have not walked away from my saltmines for pointless tasks as i did yesterday [15:54]
diana_coman: all right. [15:55]
whaack: diana_coman: a big error though that i should reveal is i have been doing my blog backups manually, since my crontab settings are wrong. I had got 13 days without running the backup script. today when i checked my blog my mysql process had crashed and the blog was down. i was able to fix the problem quickly, but had something really go wrong i would have lost my two most recent posts and some saved drafts. [15:58]
whaack: s/i had got/i had gone [15:58]
whaack: arg and s/really go wrong/really gone wrong [16:00]
diana_coman: whaack: pfft, I meant to ask what was wrong with your blog earlier today, lolz; but ...why and how come manual backups?? [16:02]
diana_coman: whaack: let me see: you set up the cron tasks but wrongly so they didn't work and you didn't check until today when you noticed it had been going on like that for 13 days so you did a manual backup; is this what you are saying there? [16:06]
whaack: diana_coman: I noticed they weren't working and I was manually running the script, but I hadn't had it run successfully for 13 days [16:07]
diana_coman: whaack: do NOT live with broken stuff like that, ffs. [16:08]
whaack: diana_coman: It takes ~3 hours now because of downloading my images (i am zipping before i download) [16:08]
diana_coman: whaack: why didn't you just...fix the cron tasks to start with? [16:09]
whaack: diana_coman: I need to fix both the crontab settings + going forward make sure my computer is left on at night. [16:09]
diana_coman: and ugh, no, it should NOT take 3 hours EACH TIME, eurgh. [16:09]
diana_coman: you use rsync and transfer only what's different, not all each time, no? [16:10]
whaack: diana_coman: No I am redownloading everything each time, not applying a diff. [16:10]
diana_coman: whaack: man rsync [16:11]
diana_coman: ahahaha, so your "crontabs not working" is just that you...turned off the computer while they were supposed to be working? [16:12]
whaack: diana_coman: lol i read that as "man, rsync" [16:12]
diana_coman: whaack: that too! [16:12]
whaack: diana_coman: I did not investigate, the issue may be that my crontab settings are incorrect or that it is not running because my comp is off / i lose connection at some point during the long download [16:15]
whaack: diana_coman: i did not know about the rsync command, i will look into it [16:16]
diana_coman: whaack: myeah; but listen here: it was clearly and obviously and even painfully a problem; which you happily chose to live with for 13 days and presumably would have continued to live with until...when? [16:17]
whaack: diana_coman: Should I keep just the most recent version of my db? I thought it may be good to have the state from the previous N days. Maybe these questions will be answered when I look into rsync [16:17]
diana_coman: whaack: the way this goes is in layers really [16:17]
whaack: diana_coman: Until I learned the hardway 'from experience' [16:18]
diana_coman: ie sure, you can and possibly should keep versions but that is layer 2 aka locally ffs. [16:18]
whaack: diana_coman: and I just dodged another bullet by getting this light scare from digitalocean [16:18]
diana_coman: because - I hope in my naivety here - that you DO have ALSO backups of your local drive to some external medium, yes? [16:18]
whaack: diana_coman: no master, I purchased extra hard drives before coming here but they are still in the box [16:19]
diana_coman: myeah; what else is in the boxes still? [16:19]
whaack: diana_coman: ...quite literally a bidet. [16:21]
diana_coman: whaack: you know, with this "will live with it broken" you are doing there exactly the no capacity and no disposition to ever mind effectively anything [16:23]
diana_coman: must be extremely useful in the boxes, obviously. [16:23]
diana_coman: whaack: this week and I don't care when you find the time for it but this week on top of what you have planned already, you get everything out of the boxes and in use. [16:25]
diana_coman: as you set up the backups properly too, from blog to local comp (and do backup everything needed) and then at least one more layer from local comp to an external drive. [16:27]
diana_coman: since your local "comp" is anyway a mac something, there's surely no raid so everything might go pouf quite easily at that. [16:27]
diana_coman: so do backup *all* your local stuff possibly; if there is anything worth anything you actually care about in there anywya. [16:28]
whaack: diana_coman: Okay. I will meditate on all the leaks i have, and do what is necessary to plug them. [16:29]
diana_coman: whaack: what are you calling a leak there exactly? [16:30]
diana_coman: for that matter iirc there was some discussion of an ups but I gather that was also not-as-sexy-as-a-car, wasn't it? [16:31]
whaack: diana_coman: It may be a bad analogy - since a leak slowly drains whereas not having backups hits you all at once. [16:31]
diana_coman: whaack: did you get an ups? [16:31]
diana_coman: it's a LACK not a leak; namely a lack of your planning, not a leak of anything. [16:31]
diana_coman: it's a shoddy mud-and-sticks-building, that's what it is, if you are looking for comparisons. [16:32]
whaack: diana_coman: No I did not get a UPS nor another source of backup internet. [16:32]
diana_coman: well sure, why get or look for something like that, since there's no friend pushing to sell one and it's only useful but not that much fun, right? [16:34]
whaack: diana_coman: The (expensive) UPS did not seem so necessary since the rainy season just about ended and the power seems to go out rarely and for less time than the battery life on my comp. At least that was how I justified not getting one to myself. [16:36]
diana_coman: whaack: so listen here, no more talks of any car until you get your house and working place in proper order as someone *working with computers* ffs, not just clucking at the screen in between surfing or whatever. [16:37]
diana_coman: you do realise that for one thing a desktop won't have battery and for the other, an UPS offers also some protection against spikes for instance if nothing else (you could in principle get that from a proper socket too but I won't dream you have that somehow). [16:38]
diana_coman: the UPS is expensive but a 20 yo car leaking oil is somehow perfectly not expensive at 0.5 btcv [16:39]
diana_coman: whaack: how do you figure out whether something is "expensive" or not? [16:39]
whaack: diana_coman: Yes, I have looked into getting one for my desktop. And you are right, I am going to fry a device eventually. The only responsible thing i've done is unplugging my shit when there are thunderstorms, which of course may not happen when I am sleeping [16:40]
diana_coman: the glory of manually doing the work of the machine, so responsible. [16:41]
whaack: diana_coman: The mistake I am making is I am judging 'expensive' solely based on initial price, not based on how negative the expected value is over time. [16:42]
diana_coman: whaack: you are clearly not judging anything there in any sense; you have some reactions and that's about it. [16:42]
diana_coman: whaack: is there more to add to this mess? [16:43]
diana_coman: at least to see it all in its full glory, can't clean anything properly otherwise. [16:43]
whaack: diana_coman: because you asked, the first thing that came to mind is i haven't taken out my wisdom teeth. they don't crowd my mouth but they leave pockets where small food can collect causing gingivitis when I am not diligent with washing those pockets out. [16:47]
diana_coman: whaack: you know, part and parcel of being an adult is taking care of *yourself*; can you start actually doing that? [16:49]
diana_coman: at that basic level, teeth and whatnot. [16:49]
diana_coman: I certainly do not want to set & follow up on tasks at the level of a 5 yo; seriously. [16:50]
diana_coman: whaack: so will you or won't you take care of yourself without prodding? [16:51]
whaack: diana_coman: yes I will [16:51]
diana_coman: I hope so. [16:52]
diana_coman: whaack: there's no ups even mentioned in that prententiously named list of first build [16:55]
diana_coman: whaack: listen here, put that guitar in the box instead of the hard drives and get your working place in proper order before touching it again; update this week's plan by this evening (your time) with clear tasks *in order of importance* to fix all this mess so that a. no more manual anything b. no more not-working anything c. proper backups d. hard-drives put to use [16:57]
diana_coman: those get sorted and sorted first. [16:58]
diana_coman: ups is next on the list and you buy it together with those computer parts already. [17:01]
whaack: diana_coman: Okay. Sorry for the slow response I had to kill some spinning. The UPS was something I was considering in my head but the reason I did not list it is because I was also thinking "maybe I do not need this." Obviously this is fucking stupid and I will look into see what other things I have not obtained that I need such as a backup way to have internet. [17:01]
diana_coman: good, do that. [17:02]
diana_coman: move the reading and the review of an outpost of progress to next week; this week you have a mess to sort. [17:02]
whaack: diana_coman: Re guitar + surfing. I have no inclination to do either at the moment as I would get no enjoyment out of either knowing that until I fix a concrete list of problems I am spiritually and even physically dying. [17:03]
diana_coman: decaying, yes; that much is true; so focus this week and sort it because it's fucking unbearable from here, I have no idea how can you live *with it* there. [17:04]
diana_coman: I'll read the updated plan tomorrow; and let me know how it goes/if you have questions. [17:05]
diana_coman: whaack: say something. [17:08]
whaack: diana_coman: It is becomes unbearable here as well as I become more in tune with reality. [17:08]
whaack: diana_coman: Only through actual hallucination / misunderstanding of my situation can I go through the day merrily. [17:09]
diana_coman: that sort of "merrily" is the insane sort really; way better off miserable while working to actually fix it. [17:09]
whaack: diana_coman: so yes I will update the plan and ask or rather beg for help out of this mess, really. [17:11]
diana_coman: all right; help is and remains available, just focus on what you need to do and otherwise ask & speak up. [17:13]
whaack: diana_coman: roger. [17:16]
diana_coman: jfw: over what interval have you been developing that wallet? if I read correctly it has already had a few iterations. [17:24]
diana_coman: Sept 2016 in crypto.py, huh. [17:26]
jfw: right, then and oct 2017 mainly; then redid/expanded the hashes in May 2018 based on the comment. [17:31]
diana_coman: jfw: was that footnote 3 required by your clients or what? [17:33]
jfw: Support for sending to 3-addresses: some fiat exchanges we were looking at used them [17:34]
diana_coman: re footnote 1 , preferable is one thing but required atm and given the tight timeframe you have there anyway, certainly not. [17:34]
jfw: agreed [17:35]
diana_coman: jfw: is that the minimum you can get away with currently (ie to actually have a working wallet)? [17:35]
jfw: hmm, the switching to builtin bignum could be skipped, or I could instead build on the Python though at this point I'm not sure that would save much [17:37]
diana_coman: doesn't sound likely to save much, no. [17:40]
diana_coman: jfw: what's the way you normally decide on those ? in there? [17:41]
jfw: looks like there's some different cases: for S-value, I'd check whether it's done already by TRB with -lows flag (don't believe it is though) [17:43]
jfw: otherwise: I'd take a guess which way is best, give it a try and see how it's going [17:44]
diana_coman: at this point and given the little time I'd say it's more likely faster whichever way you usually go about it; ie ~any outside mix in there is more likely to slow you down than make it faster. [17:44]
diana_coman: huh, that give it a try...how exactly do you "see how it's going" anyway? [17:45]
jfw: seeing what unexpected difficulties come up [17:45]
diana_coman: uhm, so you try A and if you run into ...too hard difficulties then you backtrack and try B and if that runs (later on) into harder difficulties you go back to A or search for C? [17:46]
jfw: (I'm getting the idea I should instead spend more effort on anticipating the difficulties) [17:46]
jfw: something like that [17:46]
diana_coman: I don't know if I envy you all the time you had or shudder at the idea there, lol. [17:48]
diana_coman: a big problem with that sort of approach in general is also that some difficulties are really way better to have than others, *even if they are harder*. [17:49]
jfw: because they lead to more growth? [17:51]
jfw: on the envy vs. shudder, I can imagine. How do you go about such decisions? [17:52]
diana_coman: at times simply because they don't kill the whole thing in the medium/long term; you can say lead to more growth (if you are talking of the whole business indeed) but that is in itself already quite optimistic. [17:52]
diana_coman: jfw: this sort of choices (to the extent it's about something rather important eg new rpc/btc protocol?) are normally management's decision really; precisely because that's the role of management - to be able to make the correct choice *for the business* not based on "technical difficulties encountered on the route" as such; tech supports aka provides as much relevant info from the tech perspective as required/available. [17:55]
jfw: ahh. And I'll note that "don't get lost in FFA right now, finish on what we've got" was advised by dorion. [17:56]
diana_coman: you clearly owe him a cerveza for that at least, lol. [17:57]
diana_coman: I do gather that dorion is more at ease first of all with marketing in fact; but he's clearly working on growing up the management skills too because yes, crucial. [17:58]
jfw: might get to buy that cerveza tonight. [17:59]
dorion: will collect on the cerveza tonight. [17:59]
diana_coman: jfw: what's your current plan there on tackling those and fitting them within your 13th Dec deadline? [18:00]
dorion: diana_coman agreed on the working on mgmt and how crucial it is. [18:00]
jfw: First I need to give them time estimates and deadlines and schedule the whole period [18:02]
diana_coman: jfw: well yes but ...priorities first; hence my first question earlier re what is absolutely crucial. [18:03]
diana_coman: jfw: I don't really know how fast you work in general and on this in particular (and esp since you haven't touched it in a while if I understand correctly) but as the list stands vs the 2-3 weeks available, it still seems quite a lot & esp a lot of unknowns to me. [18:05]
jfw: ah ok, transaction signing is first I think, then, hm... [18:05]
jfw: possibly some parts could be done more manually at first [18:07]
diana_coman: dorion: part of that is also to lean on the tech to support you, not to end up supporting the tech; not saying this is what happened/is happening here but just making sure it's said in clear, just in case. [18:07]
diana_coman: jfw: you see, that's part of the question you should ask dorion really - can some parts be done more manually at first? ie is that acceptable/better than ending up moving the whole thing later/crucial etc? [18:09]
dorion: diana_coman thanks. part of it was dereliction of duty as a manager. By knowing the difficulty for myself the correctly evaluate the tech aspects I left it to him to decide, since that's his expertise/domain. A big problem though was not having in 2017 the current pleasure of reading something like the article just published. [18:11]
diana_coman: jfw: basically you should provide dorion with some options that are realistic & then ask/discuss on the decision. [18:11]
jfw: I consider & spell out the options then ask, makes sense [18:12]
jfw: well "consider" as in consider what they'd look like rather than whether "best" or something [18:13]
diana_coman: dorion: yes, you are not to ask him the impossible, certainly; but you should have certainly asked for something like this article, way sooner; and jfw should have provided one even unasked, yes; but at least one of you there to have taken some steps. [18:13]
diana_coman: jfw: yes, you can and should provide as much relevant information as you can; including "what I think it's best from tech pov" but note that it's always with *that* mention: from tech pov; [18:14]
diana_coman: and you can - if needed - give justification also ie why you'd rather this than that [18:14]
dorion: diana_coman agreed. [18:14]
diana_coman: but just as jfw, you wrestle with the tech to find a working way, note that dorion has to wrestle with a much less clearly defined beast - namely the market and the future - to figure out something that works [18:15]
diana_coman: so you know, you both want to help the other with their task, certainly but part of this is *also* letting and enabling the other to actually do their part. [18:15]
dorion: and that can't happen without proper reporting on both ends. [18:17]
diana_coman: dorion: well yes; you need to tell him what the business needs and to communicate as clearly as possible what the priorities are + ask for information/details when/as you require them (and preferably with reasonable time in advance too, obv); he needs to provide you with clear, useful and timely updates on the work and with notice (preferably with enough time in advance) of forks int the road/the need for decisions. [18:20]
diana_coman: jfw: dorion you know, those s.mg board discussions in public in #t were not just for MP's and my convenience or something. [18:20]
jfw: aha, could make good reading for illustration of putting this theory in practice [18:22]
diana_coman: when I say I claim no management expertise I mean it in a very practical term: I have much more experience with (and frankly, preference for) the tech role; it doesn't mean though that I have no idea whatsoever of anything that management does (though I am sure I don't know *all* there is to do there, either). [18:23]
dorion: diana_coman thanks for spelling it out. I read the s.mg meetings as instructional ; there's a big gap between reading and doing and the doing must be done. [18:24]
diana_coman: jfw: you know, that summary I linked only the other day for a different reason & all the graphics in eulora series and so on. [18:25]
jfw: the spelling out of the theory should also be helpful in seeing better what's going on in the reading [18:25]
diana_coman: yes, not all of the S.MG board meetings are public and not all documents can be public either; that's fine; but look at the pile that is anyway public and realise that there is even more behind it all. [18:26]
diana_coman: dorion: do you have some clear(er) idea as to what would be absolutely crucial from his tasks there? ie can you give him any help prioritizing stuff in there? [18:28]
diana_coman: even if you need to discuss further between the two of you, not necessarily right now. [18:28]
dorion: diana_coman still digesting and also wrapping up for travel. I'ma give it my closest read and ask questions as needed. [18:29]
jfw: I could perhaps help with that by spelling out the ?'s better as noted here [18:31]
diana_coman: timing is not the best for sure, yes; as mentioned earlier, I'd rather think it's fastest if you coordinate on this between the two of you and get it done but if there's any help you think I can provide, just ask/speak up. [18:31]
jfw: will do, thank you [18:32]
diana_coman: jfw: if you can spell them better, do it at least directly when talking to him, certainly. [18:32]
dorion: likewise, thank you diana_coman [18:32]
diana_coman: you're both welcome. [18:33]
jfw: who would be the best at this point to direct TRB questions? mod6 or trinque perhaps? [18:33]
jfw: *to ask [18:34]
diana_coman: jfw: trinque, if he is available. [18:35]
diana_coman: I'll ask him in his chan too. [18:35]
jfw: I have some familiarity with the source, and have previously implemented a 'getrawtransaction' RPC; a way to get raw block shouldn't be too different. But good to know when to escalate. [18:35]
diana_coman: jfw: so join #trinque anyway, I asked him in chan there and see. [18:38]
diana_coman: jfw: anything else or all set for now? [18:40]
jfw: All set. [18:41]
diana_coman: good; I'll be back tomorrow. [18:44]
dorion: http://ossasepia.com/2020/04/20/ossasepia-logs-for-14-Nov-2019#1010294 << BingoBoingo http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=jea- << does that suffice ? [18:53]
ossabot: Logged on 2019-11-14 13:04:15 BingoBoingo: dorion: I haven't hammered it yet. GPG sign instructions declaring this is what you want. [18:53]
BingoBoingo: dorion: That works. Signature shows good [19:00]
dorion: BingoBoingo thank you! [19:01]
dorion: off to junto to learn about the disintegration of "typographic america" via "amusing ourselves to death" n. postman. [19:02]