| diana_coman: | morning | [02:05] |
| chetty: | morning | [04:05] |
| diana_coman: | morning chetty | [04:06] |
| diana_coman: | it gives a bit of a random error "you need to target the item" | [04:12] |
| diana_coman: | when I try to use the bandar toolkit | [04:12] |
| diana_coman: | it has inside a bundle and the right recipe etc | [04:12] |
| diana_coman: | I kind of got around that by moving around (I think that did it), but not really sure what it is about | [04:13] |
| diana_coman: | "you do not have a good tool for this sort of work" | [04:13] |
| diana_coman: | does that mean the tools I have are the right ones but the quality is not high enough? | [04:13] |
| chetty: | most likely not high enough quality diana_coman | [06:48] |
| diana_coman: | thanks chetty | [06:48] |
| diana_coman: | the odds for the small claim to give something seem to be really low now | [06:51] |
| jurov: | hello | [08:00] |
| jurov: | chetty, unusable bandar toolkit is clearly a problem. i was not able to do even a straw hat. | [08:01] |
| chetty: | could be, Iĺl bring it up with mp | [08:17] |
| diana_coman: | is there any way to see the quality of a recipe when you have it in your inventory? | [08:19] |
| diana_coman: | I mean: in store, it shows with right-click | [08:19] |
| diana_coman: | but in inventory it shows the recipe's content and I have no idea how to see the quality any more | [08:20] |
| chetty: | I dont think so, recipe qualities I dont think make a lot of difference, unlike tools and things | [08:20] |
| chetty: | jurov what quality is you bandar tool kit? | [08:21] |
| jurov: | it only says weight: 1.017 and size: 0.807 | [08:22] |
| chetty: | oh, ok, its in your inventory? I'll see if I can find it | [08:23] |
| chetty: | methinks thats something ought to get fixed, so you can see the quality of that | [08:23] |
| jurov: | in storage window, there is 8188 number, that's the quality? | [08:25] |
| chetty: | no, looking at the db I think yours 1312 | [08:27] |
| chetty: | did you make that or buy it from merchant? | [08:28] |
| jurov: | bought it | [08:28] |
| jurov: | but mp said someone made it and sold it to merchant | [08:28] |
| jurov: | so.. looks like everyone got similar quality | [08:29] |
| chetty: | yeah haha, looks like mp made it :P crafters mark :P | [08:29] |
| jurov: | heh. so he must be aware of the problem if he sold it | [08:30] |
| chetty: | well I am looking at the numbers spread, thing is pretty much everybody is about the same skill levels so the ability to get better stuff by buying from advanced players hasnt kicked in | [08:33] |
| diana_coman: | some time ago I was making things much higher quality | [08:34] |
| diana_coman: | so it might not be that he is aware really, since he was crafting at that time | [08:34] |
| chetty: | well I will layout the numbers for him, from what I see its mostly that spread is set up for a more diverse economy than we have so far. | [08:37] |
| chetty: | I suppose I should play more :) | [08:38] |
| diana_coman: | not having any clear idea of the actual system behind makes it very difficult to actually do something, especially when things still change so much that all of the sudden the quality of the things one crafts goes down by more than 30 points from one login to the next | [08:42] |
| diana_coman: | ah, something else entirely: is that spirit stat supposed to just go down/never recover? | [08:46] |
| jurov: | sigh, training tinkering does not affect the quality at all, nor one knows how much to pay | [08:51] |
| diana_coman: | jurov, you can get an idea of how much training costs, if you train first just 1 \% | [08:51] |
| diana_coman: | but you can be sure it is expensive to train a lot, lol | [08:51] |
| diana_coman: | it does seem to affect quality from what I saw like before/after, but the effect is really tiny atm from what I can tell | [08:52] |
| jurov: | id; expect mircea to make it nonlinear, | [08:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | it is nonlinear. | [08:52] |
| diana_coman: | I think it is | [08:52] |
| diana_coman: | but not as badly for 1 level | [08:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | but i'm also going to re-check it make sure it's what i wanted it to be. | [08:52] |
| diana_coman: | ah, you wanted to know how much it costs to train like 5 levels up? | [08:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | oh, to be clear : that percentile selector IS linear | [08:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | no point in having it there if not. | [08:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | but f(level) = cost is not. | [08:53] |
| diana_coman: | that was precisely my understanding of it from what I experienced, yes | [08:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha. | [08:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | the good news is, sometimes skill x+1 costs less than x cost. | [08:54] |
| diana_coman: | with effects(skill x+1) < effects(skill x)? | [08:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | no, never. | [08:55] |
| diana_coman: | I mean delta(effects) as in how much the quality increases, not that you end up truly worse for it | [08:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | even so. | [08:56] |
| diana_coman: | ok, good to know | [08:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | a skill gained is a skill gained, irrespective how you got it. | [08:56] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, I was getting a bit suspicious as to how useful the skill gained actually is | [08:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | i think this will remain an open contention for the lifetime of the game. | [08:58] |
| jurov: | yes i waanted the trainer to quote it. and tranining just seems to add a small green bar to stats, not affecting anything | [08:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | hm ? | [09:00] |
| diana_coman: | jurov, train it fully and then practice a bit and you'll level up, if you don't with the training | [09:00] |
| jurov: | trained tinkering and building by 10 and 20\%, nothing changed | [09:00] |
| diana_coman: | well, it doesn't, lol | [09:00] |
| diana_coman: | it's too little to see a difference (at least from what I noticed) | [09:01] |
| jurov: | what are these effects you wrote above? | [09:01] |
| diana_coman: | lately I got about 1 point in quality of items for 1 level up in tinkering | [09:01] |
| diana_coman: | I suspect this is also not linear | [09:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | i will say that the rng assays for the game are usually conducted in 1 trn trials sets. | [09:02] |
| diana_coman: | and based on how well you are in comparison with the others | [09:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | which means that the model contains events as likely. | [09:02] |
| jurov: | lol so 1 in 1e12 small claims will make it? :DDDD | [09:03] |
| diana_coman: | ahahaha | [09:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [09:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah, just "for a set of all behaviours possible being manifested one needs very many tries" | [09:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | makes it a bitch to test. | [09:03] |
| diana_coman: | well, I got once a polished stone and I guess that's quite as rare as it gets nowadays :p | [09:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | you mean claim ? or as loot in a different claim ? | [09:05] |
| diana_coman: | no, just claim, otherwise it would have been something already | [09:05] |
| diana_coman: | I got 2 coarse thread recipes as loot in a different claim once | [09:06] |
| diana_coman: | that was all for more than 40 small claims harvested | [09:06] |
| diana_coman: | the thing is that atm the small claims are not breaking even (for most of the common items and at my current quality, granted) and given the apparent very low likelihood of getting something out of them in the future, it seems like it should be something really big to at least break even overall | [09:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | bwahahaha. so in the good news front, turns out training cost was multiplied rather than divided. expect some massive discounts with ms. draggenfort. | [09:12] |
| diana_coman: | lol, so those who trained earlier were suckers, lol | [09:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [09:14] |
| jurov: | demnds refund | [09:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | goes looking for that diablo2 cutscene | [09:15] |
| diana_coman: | now you see jurov why the trainer did not quote the cost :D | [09:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | quite the scammy little heina huh | [09:16] |
| diana_coman: | well, she truly takes an interest in you, the description says | [09:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [09:17] |
| jurov: | hehe | [09:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | gotta love fucking magic numbers ftr. "why doesn't the db do anything again ?" "apparently the code looks up the value then drops it and just uses 42, which is hardcoded for some reason". | [09:50] |
| diana_coman: | ahahaha | [10:03] |
| chetty: | server reset in 5 | [10:53] |
| jurov: | logging of skills added to github(incl. actual numbers of practice points) | [10:54] |
| chetty: | lo | [10:55] |
| chetty: | reset done | [10:58] |
| thestringpuller: | chetty: just got max reinstalled last night, what did you need again? | [11:01] |
| thestringpuller: | poly count of something | [11:01] |
| chetty: | actually what I need is the specific number of the tri in a few locations on the models, like the palm of the hands to make attachment sockets | [11:02] |
| diana_coman: | lol, training is now cheap as peanuts by comparison to what it used to be | [11:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha. | [11:03] |
| diana_coman: | bah, it still insists on stacking together items of different quality (hence averaging their quality too) | [11:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | of course. | [11:16] |
| diana_coman: | flotsam can't be kept in separate piles, of course, it gets contaminated :p | [11:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | well basically your character's just not... savvy enough to know the difference, as of yet. | [11:25] |
| diana_coman: | it keeps saying "you struggle under the weight of your inventory" while the weight is well below max (90/116) | [12:21] |
| diana_coman: | I can move freely, no issue, but it just keeps throwing that message in the console window | [12:21] |
| chetty: | okies I'll look at it might be size(bulk) as well as weight | [12:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | it sounds like bulk yea | [12:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | prolly draining your stamina a lot, not that you'd care at this stage. | [12:35] |
| diana_coman: | the capacity is fine too from what it shows | [12:35] |
| diana_coman: | 51 out of 750 | [12:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | that's odd then | [12:36] |
| diana_coman: | oh, found that little eye thing "view item" | [12:38] |
| diana_coman: | that was what I was searching for earlier to see the quality | [12:38] |
| diana_coman: | was it there and I just did not see it? | [12:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | yup | [12:39] |
| mod6: | < diana_coman> lol, so those who trained earlier were suckers, lol << doh! | [12:41] |
| diana_coman: | yes mod6, I was speaking to myself there mostly :p | [12:41] |
| mod6: | i got chownd with that too. | [12:42] |
| mod6: | 2x | [12:42] |
| chetty: | well as stuff gets tweaked here, some will win some will lose, and on the next tweak ...who knows :P | [12:42] |
| mod6: | never got moved up a level, so promptly too my barehands off the hot stove. | [12:42] |
| danielpbarron: | mod6, same | [12:44] |
| diana_coman: | server down? | [12:46] |
| jurov: | yes, down. got a key mixup before that | [12:46] |
| jurov: | (a key said it's for small grass claim, but "unlocks small flotsam claim") | [12:48] |
| diana_coman: | ha ha, ok | [12:48] |
| jurov: | guess just some stuff wasnot wiped properly | [12:50] |
| chetty: | yeah bitten by a key, srry, back up | [13:00] |
| jurov: | Before training: SKILL: skillName:Gathering progrPoints:0 Rank:23 Knowledge:78 knowCost:7801 Practice:36000 practCost:7801 | [13:11] |
| jurov: | After training 100\%: SKILL: skillName:Gathering progrPoints:0 Rank:24 Knowledge:8161 knowCost:8161 Practice:0 practCost:8161 | [13:12] |
| jurov: | I don't like this, if I had 36000 practice, it should allow to go up moire than +1 in rank? | [13:12] |
| jurov: | if my understanding is that you're eligible to get +1 when practice points >= practice cost | [13:13] |
| jurov: | "Heinous Heina" | [13:14] |
| chetty: | well you over practice at a level .... you didnt practice at the next level :P | [13:35] |
| jurov: | well, the skills window is not helpful at all in this. | [13:42] |
| jurov: | i had to read the sauce... | [13:43] |
| jurov: | those keys, again... | [15:28] |
| jurov: | better just abolish them altogether and merge them with the scrolls | [15:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah. the current model where you get the scroll for free is temporary. | [15:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | eventually you will have to either buy or craft the scroll. | [15:38] |
| jurov: | i meant to say, server down while i diddled the keys, again | [15:52] |
| jurov: | chetty ^ | [15:52] |
| chetty: | lo, I am thinking of cleaning out jurov's inventory | [15:54] |
| jurov: | i'll gladly sell you all the keys , for 10k coppers or so | [15:55] |
| diana_coman: | chetty, are the items sold to the merchant immediately available then to buy back from him (at a diff price, of course)? | [16:18] |
| chetty: | yes | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | but then something is strange | [16:28] |
| diana_coman: | I make those threads and it says quality 75 | [16:28] |
| diana_coman: | it did not increase no matter what (I increased my skill level, no increase in quality; I increased the quality of ingredients and still no increase in quality of final product; I increased both skill level and quality of ingredients and still no change) | [16:29] |
| diana_coman: | and then I sell them to the merchant | [16:29] |
| diana_coman: | who then sells back threads of quality ...160 | [16:29] |
| diana_coman: | how is that possible then? | [16:29] |
| chetty: | well he stacks them with what he has before | [16:33] |
| chetty: | and just so you know I am going thru the code on quality calculations, just to make sure we dont have a screwup in there | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | ah, I thought the merchant stacked them by quality as it did so at least with some items | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | there are items of various quality in there, all crafted for instance by mp, so how did those end up in different stacks then? | [16:35] |
| chetty: | well merchant its not supposed to 'sort' stuff but he is remarkably stupid, I think he is sorted now to always stack | [16:36] |
| diana_coman: | ah, I see | [16:36] |
| chetty: | but we didnt clean up his old stacks, figured eventually with enough buy and sell it will sort | [16:36] |
| diana_coman: | tbh I thought there might an issue with the interface and how it showed the quality rather than with how it is calculated precisely | [16:37] |
| diana_coman: | but it probably is just this stacking thing | [16:37] |
| chetty: | no I dont think so, I think its leftover stupid merchant, which probably should have gotten cleaned up but .. | [16:38] |
| chetty: | just so I can use it for my test example what were you making when you were keeping close track of qualities? | [16:39] |
| diana_coman: | coarse threads | [16:39] |
| diana_coman: | initially with grass from the merchant (lowest quality I could find) | [16:40] |
| diana_coman: | and then with some I harvested it was around 112 quality, way higher than what I got from the merchant | [16:40] |
| chetty: | okies, ty I'll use that to test with and make sure everything works like should | [16:41] |
| diana_coman: | thank you :) | [16:41] |
| diana_coman: | oooh, I finally got something other than 1 item from a small claim, lol | [16:56] |
| diana_coman: | 1 item in the claim and apparently 6 from the loot | [16:56] |
| jurov: | i put them aside, will revisit when better skills | [17:02] |
| diana_coman: | yes, now they are worth for me | [17:03] |
| jurov: | "you have ranked up in building!" fist time i see this ever | [17:45] |
| chetty: | <jurov> "you have ranked up in building!" fist time i see this ever//grats | [18:38] |
Comments feed: RSS 2.0