| DicePower: | Fully agree | [00:00] |
| danielpbarron: | The Bible also says that His believers will be of "one mind" | [00:00] |
| danielpbarron: | they will be one "body" which is Christ's | [00:01] |
| danielpbarron: | how can one who has a false believe and is headed towards hell be of the same body as one who believes correctly and is headed towards the kingdom of heaven? | [00:01] |
| danielpbarron: | is Christ's body to be rended apart? | [00:02] |
| DicePower: | Of course not, it will be with the believers in the kingdom of heaven. | [00:03] |
| danielpbarron: | not just with, but Christ ~is~ the kingdom of heaven | [00:03] |
| DicePower: | The problem I have is with the statement "how can one who has a false believe and is headed towards hell." It seems to me like you might be saying that ANY false believe about God makes it impossible for the holder to be redeemed from the path toward hell. | [00:06] |
| danielpbarron: | not impossible | [00:07] |
| danielpbarron: | that's why i use the words "headed towards" | [00:07] |
| danielpbarron: | but it is not of their own will that they can become saved, but by Christ | [00:07] |
| DicePower: | Right, but the salvation is primarily from the punishments of sin, not the punishments of having inaccurate information, yeah? | [00:08] |
| DicePower: | So even if one had their theology 100\% ironed out and correct | [00:08] |
| DicePower: | They would still be guilty of sin. | [00:09] |
| DicePower: | They would still require Christ for their salvation. | [00:09] |
| danielpbarron: | we are all guilty of sin | [00:10] |
| DicePower: | ofc | [00:10] |
| DicePower: | There are probably no two theologians that agree with each other on EVERYTHING about God. | [00:11] |
| DicePower: | There are some things that are essential to get right. | [00:12] |
| danielpbarron: | that may be, but there are indeed at least two men on earth who agree on The Bible | [00:12] |
| danielpbarron: | and I am one of them | [00:12] |
| danielpbarron: | err. my "that may be" was in reference to your theologian statment | [00:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, server back on. | [00:12] |
| danielpbarron: | the entire Bible is "essential" ; there are no essential parts vs non essential parts | [00:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower come in, i'll give you some starter stuff. | [00:13] |
| DicePower: | I appreciate it. I'll probably jump in tomorrow, like to be well rested starting a new game ;) Plus I'm using the computer it's installed on for something else right now. | [00:14] |
| DicePower: | I'm on a different laptop | [00:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | a ok | [00:14] |
| DicePower: | Everything in the Bible is important, inspired, and inerrant, but not everything is essential to being a follower of Christ, is it? | [00:16] |
| DicePower: | For example, different translations use different words. | [00:16] |
| DicePower: | Yet two people with different translations can both be Christians, can't they? | [00:17] |
| danielpbarron: | there is no one correct translation | [00:17] |
| DicePower: | In Revelation 6:8, some translations reference a gray horse, while my NRSV references a green horse. | [00:19] |
| danielpbarron: | i like NKJV and it says 'pale' | [00:20] |
| DicePower: | The horse is either gray or green, if two people have two different translations, one might be right about the matter and the other wrong. | [00:20] |
| DicePower: | Or both wrong | [00:20] |
| DicePower: | But both people can still be Christians. | [00:20] |
| DicePower: | Because that part of the Bible is not essential for salvation. | [00:20] |
| danielpbarron: | i would say that part is indeed essential, in that we must agree on it | [00:21] |
| DicePower: | in order to be saved? | [00:21] |
| danielpbarron: | yes | [00:21] |
| danielpbarron: | in order for us ~both~ to be saved | [00:21] |
| danielpbarron: | if the color of this horse were really a contentious issue between us, I'd say check the original language from which it was translated, and compare the word used with the same word in other passages | [00:22] |
| DicePower: | So if someone only read the NRSV, and it was incorrect on that matter, and if the person wasn't aware of the alternative and had no reason to change their view on the issue. | [00:23] |
| DicePower: | That person could not be a Christian? | [00:23] |
| danielpbarron: | who made them only read that version? | [00:24] |
| DicePower: | Limitations in time preventing them for reading every translation? | [00:24] |
| DicePower: | *from | [00:24] |
| danielpbarron: | who limits time? | [00:24] |
| DicePower: | God's model of human life. | [00:25] |
| DicePower: | Ultimately God | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | :) | [00:25] |
| DicePower: | I give you credit for consistency :) | [00:25] |
| DicePower: | You hold your view on the necessary conditions of salvation to its most far reaching consequences. | [00:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower except horses can't be green. | [00:41] |
| DicePower: | http://www.etherella.com/scrapbook2/mirror_mirror.JPG | [00:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [00:45] |
| DicePower: | Was looking for an actual My Little Pony pic, I guess there's not a green one :P | [00:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | but seriously, horses can't be green anymore than you can have a baby with green hair. it's just not in the genes. | [00:46] |
| DicePower: | Maybe new genetic mutations will occur before end times? :P | [00:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | even so. the pigment space is very constrained. | [00:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno how much you care about microbiology, but let's just say it's a narrow tube, you can't fit any random thing in there. | [00:48] |
| DicePower: | So like, it takes more DNA to make a green thing than a brown thing or something like that? | [00:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | if you look for green animals, you mostly find insects, and in general they obtain the pigment from the diet rather than synthesize it. | [00:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | there's just no [biologically] cheap green to be had. | [00:50] |
| DicePower: | Do the insects pass their green on generation to generation? | [00:50] |
| DicePower: | Like does it affect them epigenetically? | [00:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | tis not very well studied. | [00:50] |
| DicePower: | ahhh | [00:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | meanwhile biologically cheap brown - heck, that's the cheapest. most mammal coloration comes off conjugated bilirubin, much like most plant coloration comes off chlorophile | [00:51] |
| DicePower: | That's really interesting that one color is easier to obtain than another. | [00:52] |
| DicePower: | Did not know that. | [00:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah. very wide variance. | [00:53] |
| DicePower: | I guess purple is a hard one in animals. | [00:53] |
| DicePower: | Seen in plants a lot, like green. | [00:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | most color is metallic ions ; most biology uses metals sparsely. there's a tension there. | [00:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | the plants are colored principally by carotenoid pigments. the more recent (and most advanced) is the green chlorophyll. | [00:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | ancient blue equivalent (xantophyll) is still deployed by algae etc. | [00:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | actually the reason leaves color in the autumn is that as the conditions worsen, the more recent (and more expensive, and more demanding) infrastructure dies off exposing the more ancient, less efficient but more hardy. | [00:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | plants die each year by going back through history of life on earth. | [00:56] |
| DicePower: | heh | [00:56] |
| DicePower: | nice | [00:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | a pigment, specifically, is colored because it ABSORBS light | [00:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | the obvious interest in light absorption is photosynthesis | [00:57] |
| DicePower: | Could a new larger tube itself be a genetic mutation? | [00:57] |
| DicePower: | Like a mutation to hold more information? | [00:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | no. the tube is given by thermodynamics, and won't ever change. | [00:58] |
| DicePower: | Well, insofar as thermodynamics is constant :P | [00:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha. | [00:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | you can practically make a larger tube, but that has its own drawbacks. | [00:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | longer* | [00:59] |
| DicePower: | Getting my green horse might be worth abandoning classical particle physics for something new. | [01:00] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower> I think what would be necessary to start with is a list of the stat categories (Intelligence, Strength, etc.), and a general idea of what each one affects. <- essentially nobody knows that really | [02:42] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower> I guess you just have to make a character and pray you don't end up with terrible genes :P <- I think the point is that you make a character and then figure out how to best play what you got | [02:44] |
| diana_coman: | and that is again with a "child" - just as you would with an actual child, you first need to figure them out sort of speak | [02:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | damn... overnight cft crafting, half level of sortage, 1/4 level of tinkering. | [09:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, auction starting in a little under 3 hours, everyone get ready! | [09:09] |
| danielpbarron: | haha i ain't missin' this one | [11:40] |
| hanbot: | if anyone's interested i'ma have another set of hammers to auction off after today's main auction. five of em. | [11:50] |
| hanbot: | they're the best things to happen to mining since slave labor! | [11:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | let's get this show on the road! | [12:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | and 10 minute tail activated a minute ago! | [12:28] |
| danielpbarron: | so far i've been recording all this on video | [13:08] |
| danielpbarron: | thinking maybe it'll look cool in fast motion | [13:08] |
| danielpbarron: | and today i learn that i can stop the recording (which starts it rendering) and then start a new recording while the first is still rendering | [13:09] |
| danielpbarron: | and when hanbot returns, i get to see if it can handle 3 at once | [13:09] |
| danielpbarron: | i bought the thorn thinking it would be nice to mix with my piles of thorns to make them all higher quality, but i see that it has crafter mark for Voyna and now i'm not sure if i wanna clobber that | [13:11] |
| diana_coman: | but is it just a plain three-pointed thorn danielpbarron ? | [13:12] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm not sure | [13:13] |
| diana_coman: | aha | [13:13] |
| danielpbarron: | i wasn't able to put it in my storage because of what i thought was a new message "take it out of container first" | [13:13] |
| danielpbarron: | i have that no video | [13:13] |
| danielpbarron: | but maybe i maxed out my lumber category (also possible) | [13:13] |
| danielpbarron: | the description is the same as usual thorns | [13:13] |
| danielpbarron: | unlike my 1mn quality basic tools | [13:14] |
| danielpbarron: | for which reason i may never end up using them | [13:14] |
| danielpbarron: | if i didn't use them while blueprint looting was a thing, i don't know why i would ever | [13:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | turns out we'll be having a little bit of trouble with the mysql yet again. | [13:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | game should be back in ~15. sorry everyone. | [13:14] |
| danielpbarron: | aha, has this something to do with my inability to store the thorn? | [13:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | quite likely. | [13:15] |
| danielpbarron: | there was a lot going on at the time but i coulda sworn it was a totally new error message | [13:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | aite, server back on. everyone please review your inventories, all good ? | [13:27] |
| hanbot: | looks good here | [13:28] |
| hanbot: | auction resuming in 5 mins unless there are further evils | [13:29] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, I seem to have lost some ibs (I was just making it throughout the auction and afterwards) | [13:29] |
| diana_coman: | prolly some 100 max so nothing major though | [13:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | myeah. im not reconstructing that by hand. bullshit server burp. | [13:29] |
| diana_coman: | will add them to the list of losses, lol | [13:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [13:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | sorry bout that. | [13:29] |
| danielpbarron: | i had nothing in my inventory but my sentimental craft table and the won thorn | [13:30] |
| danielpbarron: | uh oh, thorn missing | [13:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | no ? | [13:31] |
| danielpbarron: | nm | [13:31] |
| danielpbarron: | it got moved somehow | [13:31] |
| danielpbarron: | had to scroll down | [13:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | cuz i had to put it back in. | [13:31] |
| danielpbarron: | oh lol | [13:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | :p | [13:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | aite, let's resume. | [13:31] |
| hanbot: | skulking three-pointed thorn! | [13:31] |
| danielpbarron: | it stored this time :D | [13:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | :p | [13:32] |
| hanbot: | (auction continues!) | [13:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | did it die again ? | [13:36] |
| diana_coman: | omg, it seems so | [13:36] |
| diana_coman: | craft blocked | [13:36] |
| hanbot: | i've been silenced! | [13:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | what the everloving fuck, it's not crashed just blocked. | [13:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | and no load on the server, wtf is this. | [13:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | novel hell | [13:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | aaaand it's not coming back up. disk corruption ? who knows. stay tuned to the shitshow of wonder and mystery - it had all this crap saved up over months of smooth functioning for the auction sunday special! | [13:41] |
| hanbot: | aww. well, danielpbarron, saving your 8mn bid on the desspayr things. godspeed to server. | [13:43] |
| danielpbarron: | thanks | [13:43] |
| Birdman: | auction is in game? | [13:43] |
| danielpbarron: | loool | [13:43] |
| hanbot: | sunday auctions always are | [13:44] |
| danielpbarron: | don't worry i got it all on video, you can watch it on my youtard channel in the future | [13:44] |
| Birdman: | sweet | [13:44] |
| danielpbarron: | lotsa editing needed for this one i'm afriad | [13:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | mmmkay, we should be back again, again. | [13:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | da fuck. | [13:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | sorry everyone. | [13:46] |
| hanbot: | oh hey | [13:46] |
| hanbot: | that was better than advertised! | [13:46] |
| Birdman: | no complaints here, works out in my favor | [13:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | let's just hope it sticks. | [13:46] |
| hanbot: | resuming auction in 5 mins | [13:47] |
| Birdman: | heh lost my table again | [13:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron we're back in biznis. | [13:50] |
| danielpbarron: | coming! | [13:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | o look, 7 players. that's a record is it. | [13:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol hanbot got totally reamed | [13:59] |
| hanbot: | indeed ;/ | [13:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | apparently people have no problem whatsoever bidding a package up to 140mn, that they won't pay 70mn total for the parts. | [13:59] |
| hanbot: | y'all're....well i still like you anyway. | [13:59] |
| jurov: | error at the side of auctioner, i suppose | [14:02] |
| Birdman: | mircea_popescu could i pay you 160k for 3 of your apprentice considerations? | [14:05] |
| Birdman: | 1.6mn** | [14:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | hahaha. nope. | [14:06] |
| Birdman: | was worth a shot | [14:07] |
| Birdman: | can i pay you ~something~ for them? | [14:07] |
| jurov: | dear Birdman, do such shots before auction | [14:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | i don't think i'd sell for 100mn | [14:07] |
| jurov: | I'd have auctioned more if anyone liek you has shown the interest | [14:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | more what jurov ? | [14:08] |
| jurov: | for the bouq considerations | [14:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | oh. | [14:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | btw danielpbarron hanbot selling any incons sacrifice tokens ? | [14:09] |
| Birdman: | i thought my interest was clear for the bouq stuff | [14:09] |
| jurov: | You were wrong. | [14:09] |
| danielpbarron: | perhaps | [14:09] |
| danielpbarron: | probably a good time to try a reverse auction, or dutch auction as some call it | [14:10] |
| danielpbarron: | if hanbot is up for it | [14:11] |
| Birdman: | i dont think anyone wants to do dutch auctions | [14:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron what q and how much ? | [14:11] |
| Birdman: | i think you should just list a price and if she wants to under cut you then so be it | [14:11] |
| danielpbarron: | Birdman, that's basically a dutch auction | [14:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | ima brb eating. | [14:12] |
| hanbot: | is unfamiliar with dutch auctioning | [14:12] |
| danielpbarron: | most of mine are just under 400 quality | [14:12] |
| hanbot: | but does indeed have tokens | [14:12] |
| danielpbarron: | in a dutch auction the bidding goes down rather than up | [14:12] |
| Birdman: | hanbot its people bidding eachother down to be the one to provide the good or service | [14:12] |
| danielpbarron: | bidding is between sellers rather than buyrs | [14:12] |
| danielpbarron: | it's how they sell most cut flowers in the netherlands | [14:13] |
| hanbot: | aha | [14:13] |
| danielpbarron: | although our imense quality difference may be problematic | [14:13] |
| danielpbarron: | even my lowest quality tokens are over 100 | [14:13] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm gonna have to ponder it for now; i don't want to rush into this | [14:14] |
| hanbot: | mine are mostly in the low 100s | [14:14] |
| hanbot: | mircea_popescu only inconsequentials are useful here, not grotesques? | [14:14] |
| danielpbarron: | i got those too | [14:14] |
| danielpbarron: | as high as 40k quality | [14:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | only inconsequentials. | [14:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | and btw, anyone wanna auction some rotten teeth ? snakeskins ? md ? tlc ? dm ? | [14:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | also, anyone selling bouq numina items ? | [14:31] |
| jurov: | if anyone gives me anything to bouquinize, there will be some | [14:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | what'd you need jurov ? | [14:34] |
| jurov: | i don't even know | [14:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | ah drat, you make them low q do you ? | [14:34] |
| jurov: | just sho into the dark | [14:34] |
| jurov: | quite. | [14:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | i want them as high as can be had. | [14:34] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, what do you pay for bouq numina? | [14:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | basically, i only have 100 shots at this thing - if i don't loot more than i burn the line dies out. | [14:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman what q ? | [14:35] |
| diana_coman: | 104q | [14:35] |
| diana_coman: | collected library dusts | [14:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | mmm | [14:35] |
| diana_coman: | 1 pile of them | [14:35] |
| diana_coman: | 9999 | [14:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | 130k! | [14:36] |
| danielpbarron: | 150k! | [14:37] |
| diana_coman: | ha, go on, I'm listening | [14:37] |
| diana_coman: | 150k heard | [14:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | darn. these are the base 10 ones right ? | [14:37] |
| diana_coman: | yes | [14:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | 160. | [14:37] |
| diana_coman: | 160k heard | [14:38] |
| danielpbarron: | well i can't really use them, i just thought 130 sounded way too low | [14:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | this is so exciting :D | [14:39] |
| diana_coman: | it was basically 1.25\% on bv adjusted for q | [14:39] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah mine was a little under 1.5\% i think | [14:39] |
| diana_coman: | hanbot, any use for thee library dusts? | [14:40] |
| diana_coman: | hi fghj how's it going? | [14:40] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, did you ever get in the game? | [14:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | wait, so who got the black of desspayr ? | [14:41] |
| fghj: | ok I think | [14:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | doh danielpbarron got away with it. | [14:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | you making some danielpbarron ? | [14:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | also diana_coman : you selling that wheel bp already ? :D | [14:44] |
| diana_coman: | well, you know what? I'll sell 1 bp for 1 scone (lj skill), how is that? | [14:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | do i have scones ? | [14:45] |
| diana_coman: | I think you have 1 | [14:45] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [14:45] |
| diana_coman: | knows mircea's inventory better than himself! | [14:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | i do! | [14:45] |
| diana_coman: | aha | [14:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | hm... but it's my last scone! | [14:46] |
| diana_coman: | well, not as if I have loads of wheel bps, you know | [14:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | tell you what - 2 bps and it's a deal. | [14:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | thinking about it, i paid 25mn for a pair didn't i. | [14:47] |
| diana_coman: | and I paid 45mn for the pebbles, lol | [14:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | and grenadine basicallyo donated 70mn to s.mg lol. | [14:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | best player ever! | [14:47] |
| diana_coman: | not really a deal since I can make the wheels with those bps | [14:47] |
| danielpbarron: | mircea_popescu> you making some danielpbarron ? << you selling amuples? | [14:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok, so how much for a wheel diana_coman ? | [14:48] |
| diana_coman: | I'll have to calc on that | [14:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron trying to get them made now, yeah. | [14:48] |
| diana_coman: | amuples lol | [14:48] |
| danielpbarron: | i bought the desspayr thing because it sounded the most altary | [14:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol this game is so integrated. | [14:49] |
| danielpbarron: | althought looking again maybe the charcoal is | [14:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron nah they were chained, and i forgot | [14:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | should have outbid you really. | [14:49] |
| diana_coman: | I also thought it sounded altary; isn't it? | [14:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah charcoal -> ampoules -> ink -> conceptions. | [14:50] |
| danielpbarron: | well it's.. surprise surprise.. a gung-ho gumbo recipe! | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | aha | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | loool | [14:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | ampoules are lapidary. | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | ha | [14:50] |
| danielpbarron: | aha so glad i didn't bid on that too much | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | HA | [14:50] |
| diana_coman: | so then I should buy ampoules rather | [14:50] |
| danielpbarron: | at least got something i can theoretically use | [14:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | what'd you do with them diana_coman ? | [14:51] |
| danielpbarron: | well no you want ampule recipes | [14:51] |
| danielpbarron: | ampule is an ingredient for desspayr | [14:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | ampule ? aipule! | [14:51] |
| danielpbarron: | however | [14:51] |
| diana_coman: | if they are lapidary, I can make the stuff and then sell it , no? | [14:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman well they takle charcoal. | [14:51] |
| diana_coman: | lol, you are still trying to get everything as it were | [14:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | MINE MINE MINE!!1 | [14:52] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, what would you charge for 1 US? | [14:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | uh. | [14:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | you got moluscs ? | [14:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol two hours auctioning -> 12 hours' post-auction discovery, trade and negotiations. | [14:54] |
| diana_coman: | has some cheez if only she can find it! | [14:54] |
| danielpbarron: | hey don't you need mega high quality? | [14:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | ideally danielpbarron | [14:54] |
| danielpbarron: | oh this is not for the new thing | [14:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | it is. | [14:54] |
| diana_coman: | so I have 7 cheezez mircea_popescu | [14:54] |
| diana_coman: | does that help? | [14:55] |
| danielpbarron: | i tried to match my mollusc price with what diana_coman quoted | [14:55] |
| danielpbarron: | mine are a slightly better deal even | [14:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman with your own cheese us is not problematic, other than the bps involved. i have tm and ddl pre-made | [14:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron how much is it ? | [14:55] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron, I'm not surprised seeing how yours are really a different making, lol | [14:55] |
| danielpbarron: | 200k for 1337 quality | [14:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | o.O | [14:56] |
| diana_coman: | so mircea_popescu if I provide the cheez, how much for 1 us? and no, I can't provide the bps I'm afraid | [14:56] |
| danielpbarron: | what can i say, apparently they are really hard to get | [14:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | ;;calc 1963 * 13.37 | [14:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | 762\% huh | [14:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | well diana_coman i can't quite a cash price. let's set this aside and move to the next node. you get an us and ? | [14:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | quote* | [14:57] |
| diana_coman: | and I can make a wheel to sell to you, lol | [14:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok so you give me cheese, i give you us, you give me wheel. how much do you want for this ? | [14:58] |
| diana_coman: | well, it depends on how much I have to pay for the us, no? | [14:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | you don't, it's a package deal. just the net. | [14:58] |
| danielpbarron: | http://logs.minigame.bz/2016-02-13.log.html#t23:10:50 >> getting molluscs is a huge, angry, stuck up bitch really; atm I'd have to charge like 25k to feel fine about getting and selling molluscs (141q) | [14:59] |
| lobbesbot: | Title: #Eulora log for Saturday, 2016-02-13 (at logs.minigame.bz) | [14:59] |
| danielpbarron: | that's 900\% | [14:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron yes it is for bv, but you get more molluscs that way and so you can make more us, so it divides on a wider basis. | [15:00] |
| danielpbarron: | just saying, i need the molluscs for my own purposes and that's apparently what i'd have to pay if i didn't have my own | [15:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah. | [15:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman what's the maximal qty of us you could use up ? | [15:00] |
| diana_coman: | 4 | [15:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | whart's that make, 4 lapidary wheels ? not need any for mining remarkables or anything of the sort ? | [15:01] |
| diana_coman: | well, it doesn't look like I get to mine any remarkables, so no | [15:02] |
| diana_coman: | and yes, 4 wheels | [15:02] |
| diana_coman: | thing is: by the looks of it, it probably makes most sense to get out of lapidary and focus on resources | [15:02] |
| diana_coman: | but then it makes sense to get the bloody lj too | [15:02] |
| diana_coman: | and nobody is selling that | [15:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok, how about this deal : you provide the needed cheese for all 4 (be like 12 i think ?), i will give you the 4 us free, and you give me 1 table made and keep 3. | [15:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | actually, better deal : you give me the needed cheese, and 4 wheel bps + 4 bubbles, and i will make 4 wheels and give you 3, free of charge. | [15:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | we end up with higher q that way. | [15:03] |
| diana_coman: | so like 3 wheels cost me 4 bps that nobody ever got + 4 bubbles that I paid like 45mn on + 12 cheezez that take 36 molluscs or so | [15:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | well how you gonna get them made ? | [15:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | and no, iirc 12 cheez = 12 molluscs. | [15:05] |
| diana_coman: | 1 cheez takes 5 mollusc | [15:06] |
| diana_coman: | so it's worse! | [15:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | o wow. and it's 3 cheese to the us ?! | [15:06] |
| diana_coman: | and 1 st | [15:06] |
| diana_coman: | http://www.dianacoman.com/Eulora/Mollusc-Cheese.html | [15:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | well what do you want! not like i came up wiuth the recipe! | [15:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | o... wait. | [15:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | NOT LIKE I CAME UP WITH THE RECIPE RIGHT NOW! | [15:06] |
| diana_coman: | 1 us takes 2 so | [15:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | wasn't it 3 ? | [15:06] |
| diana_coman: | 3 yes | [15:07] |
| diana_coman: | silly finger | [15:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | 3 * 5 = 15 mollusc so 60 total ? | [15:07] |
| diana_coman: | tell you what, I am really fine farming there | [15:07] |
| diana_coman: | no need to go nuts here | [15:07] |
| diana_coman: | will sell 2 bps if that's what you want | [15:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | for how much ? | [15:07] |
| diana_coman: | but then for 1 scone + 1mn, how is that? | [15:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | glurgh | [15:08] |
| danielpbarron: | also has a spare scone | [15:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok, how about this : you give me the needed cheese for 4 us, 4 wheel bps + 4 bubbles ; i make and give you the 4 wheels, along with 200 ampoule recipes and the materials needed, and you pass me along all the ampoules you produce. | [15:10] |
| diana_coman: | I thought you didn't sell that one danielpbarron ! I ASKED! | [15:10] |
| danielpbarron: | well i didn't want to trade it for a hammer | [15:10] |
| diana_coman: | what do you want for it danielpbarron ? | [15:10] |
| diana_coman: | what does pass me along mean mircea_popescu ? like in give for free? | [15:11] |
| danielpbarron: | i'd kinda rather mp keep his and we just keep enjoying the exclusivity | [15:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman yeah. | [15:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron but how am i going to make bps! | [15:11] |
| diana_coman: | well so then you two enjoy your exclusivity, what can I say | [15:11] |
| diana_coman: | I am off farming | [15:11] |
| diana_coman: | see your exclusivities later or something | [15:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman speaking of farming... leather ? berries ? | [15:11] |
| diana_coman: | I should have about 2 stacks of berries but thought you wanted like 10 or something; still working on the leather mainly because lost time to get some tools going too as I will certainly be out of tools otherwise quite soon | [15:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | since i'm here doing nothing, might as well drop them on me | [15:14] |
| danielpbarron: | so are you gonna want not-low quality petrified tinkerer stuff? | [15:14] |
| danielpbarron: | i gave nidhogg some stuff to do but maybe i wanna do the rest myself if his low quality stuff isn't gonna be needed for a while | [15:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | atm the only numina i know how to use are bouq | [15:15] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, so you're going to get any high q wm soon then? | [15:17] |
| diana_coman: | or md for that matter | [15:17] |
| diana_coman: | ? | [15:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman well yeah, i have a pile of cs lined up but atm caught in this other wonder. but should be coming. | [15:17] |
| danielpbarron: | heh i can get >100 q md pretty easy | [15:17] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron, that I can get too | [15:18] |
| diana_coman: | it's more like 150q I am after | [15:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | thinking about it - since he has lj anyway, i guess i can't say no for your scone + 1mn deal for 2 bps. so you're on, bring 'em over. | [15:18] |
| diana_coman: | yay, bps unlocked | [15:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | not yet, we still need the ink done. | [15:18] |
| diana_coman: | what does that need? | [15:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | well danielpbarron has the bps. | [15:19] |
| diana_coman: | oh | [15:19] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [15:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [15:19] |
| danielpbarron: | supply me with amps and i'll make em | [15:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | achievement unlocked : Start Over! | [15:19] |
| diana_coman: | I was honestly wondering why is that scone so terribly precious to you seeing how you don't have exclusivity on it anyway + no time to go and lj | [15:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron that's all they take ? | [15:19] |
| danielpbarron: | they take other things that aren't so rare | [15:19] |
| danielpbarron: | beans and something else | [15:20] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't recall | [15:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | mk, and if i give you 200 amps how much for 200 inks ? | [15:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman say when you've dug it out of storage | [15:20] |
| diana_coman: | 2 wheel bps coming | [15:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | darn 1 sec sorry. | [15:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | now | [15:22] |
| diana_coman: | good luck! | [15:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | cheers. | [15:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | shockingly i had the so already made for mining my 2nd grass | [15:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | it'll have to wqait | [15:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | hmmm... anyone want the job to make me the 2 us ? i got high q ingredients but not high enough for me | [15:25] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, as I said earlier, I can make them but I don't have the bps | [15:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | i do. | [15:25] |
| diana_coman: | so what terms? | [15:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | hmmm | [15:26] |
| diana_coman: | oh and: 9999 collected library dusts 104q 160k going once | [15:26] |
| danielpbarron: | mircea_popescu> mk, and if i give you 200 amps how much for 200 inks ? << 20mn | [15:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman you give me the difference in numina bv ? | [15:27] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron you realise my amps will be higher q than your inks! | [15:28] |
| diana_coman: | how do you calc that diff? any req for numina q? | [15:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman if i give you q200 and you give me q110 diff = 90\% bv | [15:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | and no req. | [15:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman you getting the wwb/wpl out of box ? | [15:29] |
| diana_coman: | oh, geez, missed that | [15:30] |
| diana_coman: | let me get the numina too anyway, since hanbot is not around; I'll have more laters anyway | [15:30] |
| diana_coman: | so the 9999 library dusts sold at 160k | [15:30] |
| Birdman: | I have a bunchuh stacks of library dusts if they are wanted | [15:31] |
| Birdman: | Think Q53 | [15:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | truth is nobody knows yet Birdman | [15:31] |
| Birdman: | ah, thought you knew somethin to do with them | [15:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | mostly buying defensively. | [15:32] |
| diana_coman: | on the us: you give me bp+so and I give you the resulting us + numina in total base value; right mircea_popescu ? | [15:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman not just so, everything, i got it all here. q 200 cc etc. | [15:32] |
| diana_coman: | oh, good, will do then | [15:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | k hit me with the groceries when ready and we settle it all out. | [15:33] |
| diana_coman: | let me fish out now: dusts, wwb, wpl | [15:33] |
| diana_coman: | was there anything else? | [15:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | nubile slaves and assorted spices. | [15:33] |
| diana_coman: | toata lumea are morcoooovi | [15:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | o wait that's not in game yet. | [15:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | us bp q 93 => 2 * 29034*.93 = 54003.24 bv + 14 * 1.96 * 3780 + 6 * 1.49 * 87556 + 36 * 2.85 * 58 + 6 * 2.87 * 59 = 947443.86 total bv here. | [15:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyone have high q rr btw ? | [15:49] |
| diana_coman: | 1466rr 190q mircea_popescu | [15:49] |
| Birdman: | anyone selling shredding instructions? | [15:50] |
| diana_coman: | and another ~4k at ~185 | [15:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | i'll take both | [15:51] |
| diana_coman: | kk, fishing that out too | [15:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | i might Birdman, what do you pay ? | [15:51] |
| Birdman: | adjusted bv | [15:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | ... | [15:52] |
| Birdman: | q7 and q100 are the same to me | [15:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | ic. | [15:53] |
| Birdman: | doesnt add to my craft, far as i know | [15:53] |
| Birdman: | jurov: re downloading now so will keep you posted on foxybot | [15:54] |
| diana_coman: | fuck, messed it up; so mircea_popescu rr 4236 188q, 1157 181q sigh | [15:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | so lessee. 160k + 5393 * 1.86 * 67 *1.25 + 3854 * 1.38 * 152 * 1.25 + (17715 + 2693) * 1.4 * 141 * 1.25 = 7046287.375 | [15:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | not bad! | [15:57] |
| diana_coman: | sounds right | [15:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | ok and you're held for 947443 bv. | [15:57] |
| diana_coman: | yes, got that | [15:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | am i getting 'em today ? | [15:58] |
| diana_coman: | mhm, how long does it take? | [15:58] |
| diana_coman: | half hour? | [15:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | bnout an hour i think | [15:58] |
| diana_coman: | ugh | [15:58] |
| diana_coman: | I can't equip? | [15:58] |
| diana_coman: | us bps is broken | [15:59] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, ^ | [15:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | uhm | [15:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | looking into this. | [15:59] |
| diana_coman: | it doesn't fit in that slot it says | [15:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | a, gotta equip it singles. | [16:00] |
| diana_coman: | omg, 1 fits, but 2 don't | [16:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha. | [16:00] |
| diana_coman: | heh, ok, can work with that, though I don't get it why | [16:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno, too big to fit in head ? | [16:00] |
| diana_coman: | in foxy's head at least | [16:01] |
| diana_coman: | anyway, 1 today for sure, don't know about the 2nd one, quite possibly | [16:01] |
| Birdman: | small capacity, is my guess.. | [16:01] |
| Birdman: | :D | [16:01] |
| diana_coman: | prolly foxy being the idiot she is or something | [16:02] |
| Birdman: | full screen now, nice touch! hope foxybot works or i gotta re do all my macros :p | [16:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | alt-enter makes it full screen anyway | [16:11] |
| Birdman: | well it seems all graphically fucked up now, the login page | [16:15] |
| Birdman: | most things are cut off horizontally | [16:15] |
| Birdman: | is there a tutorial for foxybot somewhere? | [16:17] |
| jurov: | Birdman: http://www.dianacoman.com/foxybots-eulora/ | [16:21] |
| Birdman: | thanks | [16:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | i plucked so much nosehair... | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | also Birdman just type /bot craft for instance | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | or /bot explore | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | and it will output in the window some help | [16:23] |
| jurov: | wait, looks like I have shipped my 3200x1800 windows configuration and you ended up with overly big window? | [16:23] |
| Birdman: | mircea_popescu making your own bct? | [16:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah, csw. | [16:23] |
| Birdman: | jurov yes i think so | [16:23] |
| jurov: | Birdman: edit C:\eulora\eulorav0.1.1\euclient.cfg | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, would you mind showing me at some point the new bps so that they get added to the cookbook? it's enough to show them to foxy in game really as the bot will just read them and spit them out perfect for integration | [16:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah eventually diana_coman | [16:25] |
| Birdman: | thanks | [16:25] |
| jurov: | Birdman: there's Video.ScreeWidth/Height in the middle | [16:25] |
| jurov: | you can try FullScreen, too, report if that works | [16:25] |
| Birdman: | alt enter doesnt change anything, though the bot is functioning | [16:28] |
| DicePower: | I think it's time for science! | [16:33] |
| jurov: | huh? | [16:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [16:34] |
| DicePower: | Time to experiment :P | [16:34] |
| diana_coman: | getting in DicePower ? | [16:35] |
| DicePower: | Having trouble with the character name lol | [16:35] |
| DicePower: | Says it must contain more than two characters and only alphab (then the message is cut off) | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | oh, consulting the oracle? numerology? | [16:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | don't make shitty names. | [16:36] |
| DicePower: | My name fit the criteria though. | [16:36] |
| DicePower: | So once you create a character, can you delete it and create a new one with the same name, or is that name taken for good? | [16:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | i don't think anyone has yet deleted a character. | [16:38] |
| DicePower: | Oh, there is no way to do so? | [16:38] |
| DicePower: | Or just no one has hit the button yet? | [16:39] |
| jurov: | no, no one messed up so badly yet | [16:39] |
| DicePower: | Hehe | [16:39] |
| Birdman: | im not gonna be the first i can tell you that much | [16:39] |
| DicePower: | My plan is to create a character, record my Strength in an Excel sheet, delete, recreate, record, etc. | [16:40] |
| DicePower: | To find the range of possible values for Strength. | [16:40] |
| jurov: | yiu have your strength listed anywhere? | [16:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | how would you record your strenght ? | [16:41] |
| DicePower: | I've been told that Strength is the only inherent stat value that's still visible? | [16:41] |
| Birdman: | "explore not finished and not yet timedout, will wait" | [16:41] |
| Birdman: | no but you can see your capacity for weight dicepower | [16:42] |
| DicePower: | Ahh okay | [16:42] |
| DicePower: | That must be it | [16:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah you can see your weight capacity. | [16:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | two of them actually. | [16:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | bulk and weight | [16:42] |
| DicePower: | Each of them vary character to character? | [16:42] |
| Birdman: | yes | [16:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | myeah. | [16:42] |
| DicePower: | Okay | [16:42] |
| DicePower: | That seems like the best place to start science then :) | [16:42] |
| Birdman: | and from what i saw i dont think the total points is even across the board | [16:42] |
| Birdman: | Could be remembering wrong though | [16:43] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, you won't see the stats | [16:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | seems he's dedicated to byob. | [16:44] |
| DicePower: | Birdman: You mean, you think each stat value is assigned a random number entirely independently of the values assigned to the other stats, rather than say, each character starting with 100 stat points which are distributed to stat values in a random fashion? | [16:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | curious what'll come of this. | [16:44] |
| diana_coman: | is curious too | [16:44] |
| Birdman: | dim pretty certain the total points isn't equal throughout characters | [16:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower i can assure you it's more complicated than that. | [16:44] |
| diana_coman: | and even willing to help DicePower with some data probably | [16:44] |
| Birdman: | and past that i cant say | [16:44] |
| DicePower: | Sweet :) | [16:45] |
| DicePower: | Thanks for the dedication to science, hehe. | [16:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower you really should read the logs, there's some epic stuff | [16:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | maybe diana_coman or danielpbarron or someone links the juicier bits | [16:45] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, have you got around to read any of foxy's diary posts ? | [16:45] |
| DicePower: | That sounds like a wise idea | [16:45] |
| DicePower: | I haven't | [16:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | ah yes, and foxy's diary is pretty good | [16:45] |
| Birdman: | danielpbarron's strength was his highest and it was much higher than my highest which was intelligence, though all my stats were almost level with each other | [16:46] |
| Birdman: | while i saw dans fluxuating | [16:46] |
| diana_coman: | http://www.dianacoman.com/2015/10/22/the-unbearably-unknown-value-of-things-in-eulora/ <- DicePower this one maybe as a starter at least | [16:46] |
| diana_coman: | but do come in and walk around too , lol | [16:46] |
| DicePower: | hehe, ty for the link | [16:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | or you know, stuff like http://trilema.com/2015/the-trade-hour/ | [16:47] |
| lobbesbot: | Title: The trade hour on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. (at trilema.com) | [16:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | actually the whole s/mg category. | [16:47] |
| diana_coman: | it has some links there for further reading, that's why I chose that one | [16:47] |
| diana_coman: | and yes, including at least 2 articles in the s.mg cat on trilema as a matter of fact + some link to the logs | [16:48] |
| diana_coman: | ha ha, one IS the trade hour precisely mircea_popescu | [16:48] |
| DicePower: | then again, major headaches and quite-problems are truly the fabric of Euloran reality anyway. XD | [16:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | :p | [16:48] |
| diana_coman: | that's all right DicePower , solving them is the best thing ever :D | [16:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | has any been solved yet ? | [16:49] |
| DicePower: | Thought you might be referring to the registration system ;) | [16:49] |
| DicePower: | j/k | [16:49] |
| diana_coman: | ahahahah | [16:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [16:49] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu> has any been solved yet ? <- depends on your choice /def of "problem" | [16:49] |
| Birdman: | diana_coman: " By default, the timeout is 15 minutes, allowing amply time for your character to explore automatically even with a chetty stick. " so is this why im getting the "explore not finished and not yet timedout, will wait" message while bare handing? it seems to happen after a few explores but not the same amount | [16:50] |
| diana_coman: | if you have some lag, the message won't come through in the usual time so the bot will wait again seeing how it doesn't timeout either | [16:50] |
| diana_coman: | (it will keep waiting until 15 minutes passed and then it will just move on) | [16:51] |
| diana_coman: | obv, if the message comes through in between, it will build etc | [16:51] |
| Birdman: | ah so this is due to lag then? | [16:51] |
| diana_coman: | or maybe your exploring taking longer than the value set | [16:51] |
| diana_coman: | the bot checks every x milliseconds to see if explore is finished | [16:52] |
| diana_coman: | if yes, then build or move etc | [16:52] |
| Birdman: | hm let me pay closer attention to see whats triggering it | [16:52] |
| diana_coman: | what did you start it with? | [16:52] |
| danielpbarron: | Birdman, type this : /bot explore 10000 line 30 1 7 5000 7500 | [16:52] |
| danielpbarron: | i use 4750 instead of 5000 but idk how long yours takes | [16:52] |
| danielpbarron: | you can adjust accordingly | [16:52] |
| Birdman: | i started it with just /bot explore 10000 | [16:52] |
| Birdman: | meaning the # of times for it to explore | [16:53] |
| diana_coman: | aha, so it took the default value for the checking | [16:53] |
| danielpbarron: | you should specify the other stuff | [16:53] |
| Birdman: | so where do i alter the defaults? | [16:53] |
| diana_coman: | which is probably less that what your character takes to explore | [16:53] |
| danielpbarron: | in the source code | [16:53] |
| diana_coman: | lolz Birdman why would you alter the defaults really? | [16:53] |
| diana_coman: | set them there as danielpbarron said | [16:53] |
| Birdman: | i didnt know you could set them | [16:53] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, did you run /bot explore | [16:54] |
| Birdman: | soo lemme read up smore | [16:54] |
| Birdman: | yes | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | just type what i told you | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | and go from there | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | 30 is the number of explroes before it reverses direction | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | change to whatever you want | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | 7500 is the longest it will wait after something goes screwy | [16:55] |
| Birdman: | what does each space represent | [16:55] |
| danielpbarron: | 7500 = 7.5 seconds | [16:55] |
| Birdman: | i get it, miliseconds, what does each space represent | [16:55] |
| danielpbarron: | space? | [16:55] |
| Birdman: | ./explore [#oftimes] then the rest idk | [16:56] |
| danielpbarron: | wtf, i jsut had 1000 cft dissapear | [16:57] |
| diana_coman: | o.o | [16:57] |
| danielpbarron: | i took them out of storage, i see that in my chat box | [16:57] |
| danielpbarron: | and then i started the bot, it found a small right off the bat, and they were gone | [16:58] |
| diana_coman: | Birdman, /bot explore 10000 line 30 1 7 5000 750 -> do 10000 explores in a line going 30 steps forward then 30 back and repeat, leaving keys in the claim when done | [16:58] |
| diana_coman: | using 7 threads to build | [16:58] |
| diana_coman: | waiting 5 seconds to check if explore done/claim built | [16:58] |
| danielpbarron: | omg | [16:58] |
| danielpbarron: | my pickaxes are gone too | [16:58] |
| danielpbarron: | wtf | [16:58] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron, you sure don't have some in some table | [16:59] |
| diana_coman: | and they went there? | [16:59] |
| diana_coman: | stacked? | [16:59] |
| danielpbarron: | i had 38 pickaxes and 37 are gone | [16:59] |
| danielpbarron: | not in my table | [16:59] |
| diana_coman: | so wait, you got out of storage 1k cft and 38 pickaxes? | [17:00] |
| diana_coman: | and you had the message in the window + you had them in inv | [17:00] |
| danielpbarron: | i had just crafted the pickaxes | [17:00] |
| diana_coman: | started exploring, got 1 small and then ...no cft? | [17:00] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah then the cft and pickaxes were gone | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | the bot failed to build for lack of cft? | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | replaced by the key and ennumeration | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | did the bot build? | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah then it thought not threads so it locked and moved on | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | no | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | no build | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | oh | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | i think the key and ennumeration overlapped the threads and pickaxes | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | it sounds something like that, but not sure how would that happen | [17:02] |
| DicePower: | Interesting observation for the esoteric records: The unused attribute buttons (Face, Hairstyle, etc.) function as checkboxes rather than toggling buttons in that they can either be pressed or depressed. Each button's status is saves when you click the Back button to return to the main menu, and then reenter character creation. | [17:02] |
| DicePower: | The other information doesn't seem to be saved. | [17:02] |
| danielpbarron: | ftr these were quality 120 threads, and 10087 pickaxes i think | [17:02] |
| diana_coman: | checked back in storage if they are still there? | [17:03] |
| danielpbarron: | the pickaxes were never in storage | [17:03] |
| Birdman: | mircea_popescu what are you chargin on those shredding instructions? i have the bot so i figure i need now more than ever | [17:04] |
| diana_coman: | I meant whether either in inv or in storage | [17:04] |
| diana_coman: | as sometimes hidden | [17:04] |
| diana_coman: | oh congrats Birdman on having the bot running | [17:04] |
| Birdman: | Congrats to jurov, not me | [17:05] |
| diana_coman: | heh, it's well done to jurov | [17:05] |
| Birdman: | Suppose you're right | [17:05] |
| fghj: | I wonder what will happen when my inventory is full and loot has no free slots to take | [17:10] |
| jurov: | it ends up on your hands | [17:11] |
| Birdman: | BACKS UP INTO YOUR HANDS | [17:11] |
| danielpbarron: | fghj, is it looting correctly for you? | [17:11] |
| Birdman: | ahem , same will happen with keys | [17:11] |
| danielpbarron: | my stuff is defo gone | [17:12] |
| fghj: | yeah looks ok | [17:12] |
| danielpbarron: | i suspect it has to do with whatever brought the server down earlier | [17:12] |
| Birdman: | diana_coman what does the bot do if i become over weight while gathering and building? | [17:14] |
| diana_coman: | it stops | [17:14] |
| Birdman: | danielpbarron what are you asking for shredding instructions? | [17:18] |
| danielpbarron: | idk | [17:23] |
| danielpbarron: | maybe if i log out my stuff'll show up | [17:24] |
| danielpbarron: | ugh so annoying | [17:24] |
| Birdman: | jurov recommended values to fix the size? | [17:24] |
| danielpbarron: | oh ffs | [17:25] |
| danielpbarron: | someone is very wrong here | [17:25] |
| danielpbarron: | i recommend server shut down | [17:25] |
| danielpbarron: | now i have 21 pickaxes quality 10087 and nohting else in my inventory | [17:26] |
| danielpbarron: | so i lost my very old craft table, and my 1000 bits | [17:26] |
| danielpbarron: | quality 55 on the bits ftr | [17:26] |
| danielpbarron: | mircea_popescu, ^ | [17:27] |
| diana_coman: | do you have the cft in storage now danielpbarron ? | [17:27] |
| danielpbarron: | i can't remember exactly how many i had | [17:27] |
| danielpbarron: | it shoudln't matter, the pickaxes were never in storage | [17:27] |
| danielpbarron: | and why 21 now? | [17:27] |
| danielpbarron: | the nubmer doesn't even make sense | [17:28] |
| danielpbarron: | did it freeze? | [17:28] |
| diana_coman: | I don't know, it seems to work fine for me really | [17:28] |
| danielpbarron: | there it goes | [17:28] |
| diana_coman: | oh | [17:28] |
| danielpbarron: | maybe it was the location where i tried to gather, behind the weird teleporty door to the graveyard | [17:29] |
| danielpbarron: | right before it went down, i couldn't walk through the small claim that i no longer have the key to | [17:29] |
| danielpbarron: | it would bump my character to the side as i tried to move thruogh it | [17:29] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron wasn't that a place which we knew already it was a bit fucked up as someone else got stuck around there? | [17:30] |
| danielpbarron: | i wasn't in the graveyard though | [17:30] |
| danielpbarron: | i was behind the houses, just trying to get a few spicy moss to get mining past the first easy ranks | [17:30] |
| diana_coman: | yes, but lol, all that area is nice easy moss, don't need to bump into the graveyard thing - it seems to be a bit shaky for sure | [17:31] |
| danielpbarron: | i didn't realize that was the problem | [17:31] |
| danielpbarron: | i thought someone crashed it ~in~ the graveyard | [17:31] |
| diana_coman: | well, now will wait, I really hope the US I just built is still there | [17:31] |
| danielpbarron: | maybe DicePower caused it, with deleting a character | [17:32] |
| DicePower: | Hehe, I didn't quite get to that point, it asks for your password to delete, and I was still typing it in. | [17:32] |
| danielpbarron: | i didn't even explore when it crashed, i just walked over there to see if my craft table was put down | [17:32] |
| danielpbarron: | and then when i right clicked the small claim, no options appeared | [17:33] |
| diana_coman: | hm, weird | [17:33] |
| diana_coman: | maybe it was something else entirely | [17:34] |
| DicePower: | FYI, for my first character, my "Weight" was 462.69, and my "Capacity" was 301. | [17:34] |
| DicePower: | *is I should say | [17:34] |
| DicePower: | Since haven't deleted yet | [17:34] |
| DicePower: | I will keep everyone updated on the ranges when anything interesting happens. | [17:34] |
| Birdman: | Notice how we're all exactly alike? Welcome to the cult DicePower | [17:35] |
| diana_coman: | oh, are you trying to figure out like min and max on those DicePower or what? | [17:35] |
| DicePower: | Birdman: Hehe, how are you all alike, you mean appearance wise? :P | [17:35] |
| Birdman: | Yes meant appearance lol | [17:35] |
| DicePower: | diana_coman: Yes! | [17:35] |
| DicePower: | I think determining min and mix for the values that ARE shown is a good first step. | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | hm, trouble is : when do you consider you got those values DicePower ? | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | if you do 10000 runs and the lowest you saw is 50, does that make it lowest possible? | [17:36] |
| DicePower: | When I get quite a few X's in my data set but on X - 1's? | [17:36] |
| DicePower: | You can't expect 100\% certainty doing this type of thing of course. | [17:37] |
| DicePower: | But I'm hoping it becomes pretty obvious. | [17:37] |
| diana_coman: | it's not really certainty of min/max to expect, but at least certainty of what exactly you plan to do, lol | [17:37] |
| DicePower: | The other thing that might be a major clue is the correlation between the two values. | [17:37] |
| DicePower: | I think it will be very helpful in answering the question, "does 1 value tend to go up when the other goes down?" | [17:38] |
| diana_coman: | true, fwiw I can tell you from earlier days that I saw 10+ stats iirc | [17:38] |
| DicePower: | I'm hoping someone will be able to supply a screenshot of their stat list. | [17:39] |
| diana_coman: | I'm sure at least someone is able to - not sure if anyone is willing to | [17:39] |
| DicePower: | Wouldn't be able to determine ranges from it, but at least see what stats we're working with. | [17:40] |
| diana_coman: | oh, I can tell you from memory that there are at least strength, endurance, intelligence, wisdom, dexterity | [17:40] |
| diana_coman: | constitution too I think | [17:41] |
| DicePower: | Nice, and Weight and Capacity are two more? | [17:41] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, no | [17:41] |
| diana_coman: | weight and capacity are the result of some combination of some of the stats | [17:41] |
| diana_coman: | isn't that clear as mud, lol | [17:41] |
| DicePower: | Ohh got it | [17:41] |
| DicePower: | I understand the concept | [17:41] |
| DicePower: | It's used in Entropia Universe for attributes | [17:41] |
| DicePower: | and professions | [17:42] |
| diana_coman: | well , or so I figured it out and I really don't think I saw weight and capacity as stats in the window as such, lol | [17:42] |
| DicePower: | cool | [17:42] |
| DicePower: | So that might mean it's harder to infer anything from a correlation between the two. | [17:42] |
| DicePower: | But might still learn something from a correlation or lack there of. | [17:42] |
| diana_coman: | yep, this is why I was asking at first what it is exactly you are trying to do | [17:42] |
| DicePower: | Right now I'm just trying to get a foot in the door of the stat system. | [17:43] |
| DicePower: | Not sure exactly where it will lead. | [17:43] |
| DicePower: | Or how deep we can go with it. | [17:43] |
| DicePower: | mircea_popescu has said that the system is very complex, so probably won't be able to discover it in its entirety. | [17:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | gah | [17:45] |
| DicePower: | But might be able to answer the question, "is it better to have high Weight/Capacity, or low" at least. | [17:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's certainlty better to have it high | [17:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | you can carfy more | [17:45] |
| DicePower: | Unless that is correlated with lower stat values elsewhere, on average, right? | [17:46] |
| DicePower: | ...or like | [17:46] |
| DicePower: | The stat values that are used to calculate Weight/Capacity are correlated with lower other stat values. | [17:46] |
| Birdman: | As i was saying i dont think having high of one correlates to low others | [17:46] |
| Birdman: | all mine were very near each other iirc | [17:46] |
| Birdman: | you could very well have crazy high of all | [17:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | no lunch is free. | [17:47] |
| DicePower: | Hmmmm | [17:47] |
| Birdman: | or really low, i dont think having one high means you're guaranteed lower results in others | [17:47] |
| Birdman: | iirc dan had more overall than me, and had stats higher than mine | [17:48] |
| DicePower: | "No lunch is free" Was that in response to me, or to the "could have all stats crazy high with no drawback" thing? | [17:49] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, for some taste of stuff: http://trilema.com/2015/euloraleaks/ | [17:49] |
| lobbesbot: | Title: Euloraleaks on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. (at trilema.com) | [17:49] |
| DicePower: | ty | [17:49] |
| DicePower: | So the weight and capacity are both under 100 in that pic | [17:50] |
| diana_coman: | the pic might be very very old | [17:51] |
| diana_coman: | but I meant about the approach re complexity of the game | [17:51] |
| diana_coman: | read the text | [17:51] |
| DicePower: | I read it | [17:52] |
| DicePower: | I warn you, if you're the obsesive-compulsive explorer type, stay away. | [17:52] |
| DicePower: | Guess I'm uninstalling :) | [17:52] |
| DicePower: | lol | [17:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman> or maybe your exploring taking longer than the value set <<< all these problems were related to a db server issue we've been having all day. | [17:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | HOPEFULLY it is finally shot in the head. | [17:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | apologies yet again for all inconvenience. | [17:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | server should go back up momentarily. | [17:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | in unrelated news, methinks DicePower will have a lot of fun with eulora lol | [17:59] |
| DicePower: | :D | [17:59] |
| DicePower: | Sweet | [17:59] |
| DicePower: | I think getting past the first part with the stats will be the roughest part for me. | [18:00] |
| DicePower: | Then I'll relax a bit lol | [18:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | ftr there were 10+ stats showing back in the day. | [18:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | oh diana already said that | [18:00] |
| DicePower: | And they're still in the game, just not publicly displayed, from what I've been informed. | [18:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower> Unless that is correlated with lower stat values elsewhere, on average, right? <<< well that's a given. | [18:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | "is it better to be taller or shorter ?" "taller, the chicks dig you more" "unless there's lasers cutting heads above a certain height" "doh" | [18:02] |
| DicePower: | Hehe | [18:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | so danielpbarron what are you short ? 10 pickaxes q 10k was it ? | [18:02] |
| danielpbarron: | lemme see when i get back | [18:03] |
| DicePower: | Are you saying that you find it silly to think that low values in one stat are compensated, on average at least, but higher values in another stat? | [18:03] |
| DicePower: | I was initially going off of this convo http://hastebin.com/zomafiqubi.xml Birdman seems to disagree on the matter. | [18:04] |
| lobbesbot: | Title: hastebin (at hastebin.com) | [18:04] |
| DicePower: | So on the one hand, you would want to aim for a LOW Weight/Capacity | [18:04] |
| Birdman: | Feb 13 22:03:20 <danielpbarron> maybe aim for a ~low~ number as that means you have less strength and more of some stat << keyword is maybe | [18:05] |
| danielpbarron: | i should have in total : 1k q55 bits, 1k q120 threads, 1 q195 craft table made by Mircea, 38 q10087 pickaxes (one was used 2 times so it's more like 9k something) | [18:05] |
| DicePower: | Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the actual :) | [18:05] |
| Birdman: | and to quote myself <Birdman>iirc dan had more overall than me, and had stats higher than mine | [18:05] |
| Birdman: | higher stats and more overall points, though mine were very evenly distribute | [18:05] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, I think the point is exactly that there is no set/fixed/objective "best" | [18:06] |
| danielpbarron: | i had low inteligence and other smart sounding stuff | [18:06] |
| diana_coman: | that's why it's more about finding the best way to play your configuration rather than trying to figure out what is the best configuration to play the game since there prolly isn't one | [18:06] |
| danielpbarron: | my character is the dumb strong one it seems | [18:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | ^ what diana said. | [18:07] |
| diana_coman: | foxy also has low intelligence fwiw | [18:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | there is quite certainly no "optimal character" | [18:07] |
| DicePower: | Well, isn't aren't stats of 2/2/2/2/2/2/2 strictly better than 2/2/2/2/2/2/1? | [18:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | it is not possible for this comparison to appear in game. | [18:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman you're gettin ga bundle back. | [18:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | what q were they, 163 ? | [18:08] |
| DicePower: | You mean that you cannot reduce one number without increasing another, and vice versa? | [18:08] |
| diana_coman: | hm, I think it was lower than that, but not sure the number exactly :( | [18:08] |
| DicePower: | Or just that 2 is too low a number to appear? | [18:08] |
| diana_coman: | I guess I can start the next one and see though | [18:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower i mean that a/a/a/a vs a/a/a/a+1 is not mathematically possible. | [18:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman best idea. | [18:09] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, 153q | [18:09] |
| DicePower: | Okay, that's very interesting | [18:09] |
| danielpbarron: | it's probably too annoying to restore a claim key + ennum so you could just pretend like i never used any of the pickaxes and they are all 10087 | [18:10] |
| diana_coman: | I need the bp back too since really I had the finished item and everything | [18:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman k. | [18:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron how many axes you got left ? | [18:10] |
| danielpbarron: | is it back up? | [18:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | yup | [18:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower you gonna be fucking around deleting this char ? or gonna play witi t ? | [18:10] |
| diana_coman: | come in DicePower, the water is great | [18:11] |
| DicePower: | mircea_popescu: I find it very interesting that the system can't arbitrarily increase one stat, while at the same time you say it is "certainly better" to have higher Weight/Capacity. | [18:11] |
| DicePower: | This is my second character, I will be deleting it many times I think :P | [18:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower well obviously, capacity is a good. | [18:11] |
| danielpbarron: | i have 21 pickaxes right now (and nothing else) | [18:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | aite. once you're done with that say and i'll giove you some starter items. | [18:11] |
| DicePower: | By the way for everyone's benefit, you can delete characters and recreate a new one with the same name. | [18:11] |
| DicePower: | Sweet, thanks :) | [18:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron ima give you 1 coin in compensation because i'm too lazy to actually fix the litany of items. | [18:12] |
| danielpbarron: | oo, got my craft table, was still in town | [18:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | yea | [18:12] |
| danielpbarron: | k | [18:12] |
| danielpbarron: | that table is priceless! | [18:12] |
| diana_coman: | 1 coin aka 1 btc? o.o | [18:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah. | [18:14] |
| danielpbarron: | thanks | [18:15] |
| danielpbarron: | so is it safe for me to go exploring again? | [18:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | trade diana_coman | [18:15] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm afraid to touch anything now | [18:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron i wqould think so. | [18:15] |
| diana_coman: | oh well, will just interrupt it I guess | [18:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah | [18:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | doesn't work during ? | [18:15] |
| diana_coman: | doesn't seem to | [18:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | oddball. | [18:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | i trade whiole crafting all the time | [18:15] |
| diana_coman: | I clicked accept and then it said you can't trade while etc | [18:15] |
| diana_coman: | while working | [18:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | weird lol. | [18:16] |
| diana_coman: | nope, again | [18:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | this may be the one craft we did right lol. | [18:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | amnyway, it';s here when you're done. | [18:16] |
| diana_coman: | do you trade while actually working on something or between starting 2 items? | [18:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | while. | [18:16] |
| diana_coman: | weird | [18:16] |
| DicePower: | Esoteric Tip #2: If you delete your character and recreate one, the game will remember if your Inventory window (and probably other windows) was open or not. | [18:19] |
| DicePower: | The first 5 accounts have been created. The results at this point are Weight ranges from 352.77 to 586.97 and Capacity ranges from 282 to 592. | [18:23] |
| DicePower: | Time to do 99999995 more trials. | [18:23] |
| diana_coman: | ahaha, you're getting into the spirit there DicePower with the number of trials | [18:24] |
| danielpbarron: | huh, my capacity is lower than your lowest and my weight is higher than your highest | [18:24] |
| DicePower: | LOL | [18:24] |
| DicePower: | Nice | [18:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower do you know how to do proper variance calculations etc ? | [18:24] |
| DicePower: | I've done it before, pretty much forgotten. I'm no expert at it. | [18:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | there's an actual method to evaluate your marginal confidence gain per assay | [18:25] |
| DicePower: | Would have to look it up again. | [18:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | hey, eulora is unforgiving on the math. you'll have to. | [18:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | many a player had to clean the cobwebs off r | [18:26] |
| DicePower: | Since botting is allowed in this game, it might be a good idea to automate this cycle to collect more data. | [18:26] |
| DicePower: | Not sure if it's worth the time though. | [18:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | prolly not, but every man decides for himself. | [18:26] |
| DicePower: | Since this is just one step in a larger project | [18:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | there's much better things to be measuring tho. | [18:27] |
| DicePower: | aye | [18:27] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, seeing how you are after data, you might enjoy http://www.dianacoman.com/2015/12/20/foxys-dismal-scribblings-on-euloran-exploration-data-or-truly-horrible-numbers/ | [18:30] |
| DicePower: | ty | [18:30] |
| diana_coman: | foxy is not exactly the very sunny type, but the numbers are there, lol | [18:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | reads old articles... hey diana_coman remember when we were dealing in 100s of items ? :D | [18:33] |
| diana_coman: | heh, for some reason I can't shake out of my head the 50-samovars run | [18:34] |
| Birdman: | ive wondered why most things in game are just by nature. Worn, dismal, grotesque, worthless, with discriptions matching | [18:34] |
| Birdman: | are just shoddy* by nature | [18:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | gotta start somewhere. | [18:34] |
| Birdman: | right, maybe when we leave the island or whatever things suck less | [18:35] |
| diana_coman: | in the optimistic interpretation: so that they can get better, go up, become something | [18:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | ^ | [18:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | in other lolz : 1 btc = 100mn ECu or at the same time ~8914400 VND. so it's like 10 ECu to the VND. | [18:46] |
| Birdman: | what is vnd? | [18:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | vietnamese currency | [18:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | aptly called the dong. | [18:46] |
| Birdman: | i talked to a guy, sort of professional online poker played | [18:46] |
| Birdman: | told me he spent the better part of his young adult life playing online poker and with the relatively small amounts he'd win, just live like a king banging chicks over there | [18:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | what's the third world for. | [18:48] |
| Birdman: | mhm | [18:48] |
| Birdman: | that and factories | [18:48] |
| DicePower: | Got a 766.28 Weight and 687 Capacity character. New high for each. | [18:49] |
| DicePower: | Only 12 trials deep though | [18:49] |
| DicePower: | I'm sure it gets higher. | [18:49] |
| Birdman: | Which is actually my argument against anyone saying goods should be bought locally. Have they seen detroit? Any city really. Urban sprawl and all that | [18:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | make sure you put your results in the wiki | [18:50] |
| DicePower: | Sure, I'm saving them all in a spreadsheet, will upload them all once I figure out what going on with it :) | [18:50] |
| DicePower: | Do any of the 10+ stats have an impact on any activity that you can do for free? | [18:52] |
| DicePower: | In other words, should I be testing something else for each character, like a range of damage taken or something? | [18:52] |
| Birdman: | there's not much to go on right now, but there are theories one could be better at tinkering or gathering than another based on these stats, | [18:53] |
| jurov: | only thing you can reasonably test for free is damage and results from barehand mining | [18:53] |
| jurov: | (/explore command) | [18:53] |
| DicePower: | okie | [18:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | can't recall if that crashes the server or not. | [18:54] |
| jurov: | barehand mining? | [18:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | without skill | [18:55] |
| jurov: | o i forgot, must eat skill. so not completely free, scratch that. | [18:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | how would he test results anyway, count tinies ? | [18:55] |
| jurov: | he'd find a way :) | [18:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [18:55] |
| DicePower: | Is there a random element to each instance of damage in this game, or do you take the same amount every hit? | [19:04] |
| DicePower: | Got a 243.5 Weight | [19:08] |
| DicePower: | So it's pretty clear that there's not a uniform distribution across the range of possible values. | [19:09] |
| DicePower: | Which is exactly what you would expect given that each value is derived from multiple stat values. | [19:10] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower> Is there a random element to each instance of damage in this game, or do you take the same amount every hit? <- so far there is no fighting as such in game; you get hit basically by exploring and that is fixed in the sense that so far each attempt resulted in the same damage for foxy at least | [19:12] |
| diana_coman: | btw, don't be afraid to /die in game | [19:12] |
| diana_coman: | (death is not yet permanent) | [19:13] |
| danielpbarron: | DicePower> Got a 766.28 Weight and 687 << delete that one!! nobody can carry more than me!! | [19:14] |
| DicePower: | LOL | [19:14] |
| DicePower: | Hopefully death is never permanent. Those games are always more stress than fun heh. | [19:14] |
| DicePower: | Not sure it would work well in an MMO either. | [19:14] |
| DicePower: | danielpbarron: It's long gone :P | [19:15] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, death will be permanent in eulora from what has been revealed, but only after marriage is implemented and therefore your character will have children | [19:16] |
| DicePower: | I wonder if different characters even take different amounts of damage or if it's completely fixed for everyone. | [19:16] |
| diana_coman: | so it's death of a character, not of an account | [19:16] |
| diana_coman: | well, what has been noticed so far is that for instance danielpbarron seems to get a different decay on one specific tool than what me and mircea_popescu noticed | [19:17] |
| diana_coman: | make of that what you may | [19:17] |
| DicePower: | Could that be related to the quality of the tool? | [19:17] |
| danielpbarron: | i may have written it down wrong | [19:17] |
| diana_coman: | not to the quality of the tool, no | [19:17] |
| danielpbarron: | which tool was it? i've been meaning to test it again | [19:17] |
| diana_coman: | the toolkit danielpbarron | [19:17] |
| danielpbarron: | k | [19:17] |
| DicePower: | Soooo, my initial results/thoughts after creating 20 characters: | [19:32] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu, 1 us ready, you around? | [19:32] |
| DicePower: | Max Weight: 766.28 Min Weight: 243.5 Max Capacity: 687 Min Capacity: 282 | [19:33] |
| DicePower: | While I did get variance between the Weight and Capacity on a single character as great as 304.97, usually the values were pretty close to each other. To be more precise, in 11 out of the 20 trials, Weight and Capacity varied from each other by less than 100. | [19:35] |
| DicePower: | That seems significant considering the ranges of Weight and Capacity were 522.78 and 405 respectively. | [19:35] |
| DicePower: | I would infer that probably, Weight and Capacity are calculated using some of the same underlying stat values. | [19:35] |
| DicePower: | Which would predict some degree of positive correlation between them. | [19:36] |
| DicePower: | Next time, I will try to see if I can add damage to the list of things to track. | [19:37] |
| DicePower: | Or see if damage is fixed for all characters. | [19:37] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, how do you intend to track damage or what do you have in mind when saying "damage"? | [19:38] |
| DicePower: | You said that you get "hit" by exploring? | [19:38] |
| diana_coman: | one important thing to understand about eulora is that NOTHING gets created out of nowhere | [19:38] |
| diana_coman: | which means that everything has a cost too | [19:39] |
| diana_coman: | the cost of exploring is either tool decay (if you use a tool) or person-decay (hence damage) if you use bare hands | [19:39] |
| danielpbarron: | you can't explore without the skill | [19:39] |
| diana_coman: | I suppose if you really want to track something DicePower you can track things like stamina rather | [19:39] |
| diana_coman: | though I don't think anybody bothered so far | [19:39] |
| danielpbarron: | also, my capacity is still under your lowest | [19:39] |
| DicePower: | How would that go? | [19:39] |
| danielpbarron: | i guess my guy is exceptionally bad at carrying things | [19:40] |
| DicePower: | Wow danielpbarron, that's unlucky (or maybe lucky if you are correct about one stat being lower causing another to be higher). | [19:40] |
| diana_coman: | well, basically you can run out of breath or something and therefore you can't run anymore | [19:40] |
| diana_coman: | I think I had that when either moving too fast/uphill with lots to carry or something | [19:40] |
| DicePower: | Is there a number associated with Stamina? | [19:40] |
| diana_coman: | heh, I'm sure there is, but you'll find that the interface is VERY poor in concrete numbers (by design) | [19:41] |
| danielpbarron: | what? i've never moved slower from what i can tell | [19:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman now i am yes | [19:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | trade me | [19:41] |
| diana_coman: | aha | [19:41] |
| DicePower: | So what aspect would be amenable to tracking? | [19:41] |
| DicePower: | Like time how long you can run before slowing down? | [19:41] |
| diana_coman: | you can see some bars | [19:41] |
| diana_coman: | and yes, time | [19:42] |
| diana_coman: | so mircea_popescu that's q120 | [19:42] |
| danielpbarron: | i didn't think those did anything | [19:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman yea | [19:42] |
| DicePower: | Ahh I see the bars | [19:42] |
| DicePower: | Health/Blood/etc. | [19:42] |
| diana_coman: | but the 2nd one will be tomorrow as it's already 1am here | [19:42] |
| diana_coman: | yes, those DicePower | [19:42] |
| diana_coman: | well, there's one called stamina, lol | [19:43] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron, it might have been when I was going TOO fast, lol | [19:43] |
| diana_coman: | as in:faster than normally possible | [19:43] |
| DicePower: | So the hypothesis would be that for different characters, the bars move at differing speeds depending on a player's underlying stat values? | [19:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower> So it's pretty clear that there's not a uniform distribution across the range of possible values. << heh. | [19:43] |
| diana_coman: | that's my hypothesis, yes | [19:43] |
| diana_coman: | didn't bother to test it in the slightest, but since you asked what you can test for free at this stage.. | [19:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | DicePower> Hopefully death is never permanent. Those games are always more stress than fun heh. << death will be permanent. | [19:44] |
| DicePower: | :( | [19:44] |
| DicePower: | diana_coman: Sure I can give it a try | [19:44] |
| Birdman: | DicePower you'd want it to be | [19:44] |
| Birdman: | or you'd probably end of forever mediocre | [19:44] |
| Birdman: | end up* | [19:45] |
| DicePower: | I have yet to be able to enjoy such a game, but I'm open minded. | [19:45] |
| DicePower: | Always feels risky to play, never want to play when tired, etc. lol | [19:46] |
| Birdman: | Yeah same, almost the entire game is new shit for me | [19:46] |
| diana_coman: | DicePower, I'll soon set the bot for the night and blissfully go to sleep while the work gets done | [19:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | you will guaranteedly die in a coupla years anyway. death of natural causes. | [19:46] |
| DicePower: | Anyways, back in a bit. | [19:46] |
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