| danielpbarron: | crashed! | [00:09] |
| danielpbarron: | chetty, mircea_popescu ^ | [00:09] |
| danielpbarron: | glad i didn't drop my altar yet | [00:10] |
| danielpbarron: | sucks for Birdman | [00:10] |
| Birdman: | i got time to wait | [00:10] |
| Birdman: | just let me know when its up | [00:10] |
| Birdman: | why i paid over a million for 500 of those drafts is beyond me now | [00:11] |
| Birdman: | when i generated thousands | [00:11] |
| danielpbarron: | i'd pay a million for 1k | [00:12] |
| Birdman: | might not be worth it | [00:12] |
| Birdman: | are there other drafts in existence? | [00:12] |
| danielpbarron: | you got em all | [00:12] |
| danielpbarron: | i would not be buying them to use | [00:13] |
| Birdman: | >:) | [00:13] |
| Birdman: | you'd generate loot from them | [00:13] |
| danielpbarron: | no i'd just hold them | [00:13] |
| Birdman: | gpg contract or gtfo | [00:14] |
| danielpbarron: | a non compete thing? | [00:14] |
| Birdman: | well, if i have them all, if i let any out, there could be more generated | [00:15] |
| Birdman: | so, id really only be putting a strangle on your sacrifice skill | [00:15] |
| Birdman: | but, they all level the bouq | [00:15] |
| Birdman: | so im not sure what else is around that can level that | [00:16] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm still gonna bring enumerations to you | [00:16] |
| Birdman: | ill make your stuff | [00:16] |
| Birdman: | just dont need any floating around | [00:16] |
| danielpbarron: | i just want a back up in case you fall off the face of the earth | [00:16] |
| danielpbarron: | or if you run out somehow | [00:16] |
| Birdman: | if i die, come to my house and its in a note on my desktop | [00:16] |
| Birdman: | they will be safe | [00:17] |
| danielpbarron: | lol i'm never mining a small or a tiny again | [00:20] |
| danielpbarron: | is that what all the drafts want? | [00:21] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll probably keep mining small basic harvestables | [00:22] |
| danielpbarron: | but i don't have an advantage mining the less common stuff | [00:22] |
| Birdman: | no not all enums | [00:24] |
| danielpbarron: | oh | [00:24] |
| danielpbarron: | well i know the more advanced ones need velum | [00:24] |
| danielpbarron: | i made some velum if you need that | [00:24] |
| Birdman: | and the higher quality i start with the better for your skill | [00:24] |
| Birdman: | yes | [00:24] |
| Birdman: | vellum and something in a bottle | [00:24] |
| Birdman: | forget what | [00:24] |
| danielpbarron: | gonna need some clovers | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | leaky treebark flask | [00:25] |
| Birdman: | no | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | gin | [00:25] |
| Birdman: | nope | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | beetlebrew | [00:25] |
| Birdman: | that mightve been it | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | these are all things you will want to buy in large quantities | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | right now clovers is the "bottle neck" | [00:25] |
| Birdman: | yes | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | i should be getting some clovers soon | [00:25] |
| danielpbarron: | if these leather supplications are anythign like the berries ones | [00:26] |
| danielpbarron: | and if not, we gotta make berries next | [00:26] |
| danielpbarron: | those give me clovers as loot, and clovers are used to make the gin that makes your velum | [00:26] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll be able to have like a real legit store soon | [00:27] |
| Birdman: | nice | [00:27] |
| danielpbarron: | http://danielpbarron.com/languages.txt | [00:31] |
| diana_coman: | morning | [00:31] |
| danielpbarron: | hello | [00:34] |
| diana_coman: | Birdman are there other drafts in existence? << do you mean those that you can get from bouq? | [00:35] |
| diana_coman: | if yes, then I still have some and in any case, they can still be obtained | [00:35] |
| danielpbarron: | he means the new ones | [00:36] |
| diana_coman: | leather or something else? | [00:36] |
| danielpbarron: | leather and other ones we didn't get before | [00:36] |
| diana_coman: | leather can still be gotten | [00:36] |
| danielpbarron: | how's that? | [00:37] |
| diana_coman: | lol, it comes out of bouq too | [00:37] |
| danielpbarron: | so you had some of these already? | [00:37] |
| danielpbarron: | or you can now make them? | [00:37] |
| diana_coman: | not leather no, as I kept getting other stuff and then I just didn't get around to do any more bouq | [00:37] |
| danielpbarron: | apparently it wasn't gettable | [00:38] |
| diana_coman: | well yes, it wasn't gettable in the beginning I gathered? | [00:38] |
| diana_coman: | but then it was fixed? | [00:38] |
| diana_coman: | and oh, Birdman, if you need tiny+small enums I have some stashes in storage and I'll sell them np | [00:39] |
| Birdman: | i will buy them all | [00:39] |
| danielpbarron: | goes without saying i'll buy all the supplications you make | [00:39] |
| Birdman: | mhm | [00:39] |
| Birdman: | wanna join and play 20 chep table | [00:40] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll play poker when it's in eulora | [00:40] |
| Birdman: | was wront tab lol | [00:41] |
| diana_coman: | wow, if anyone is curious, this must be the longest dry xplore run I've ever seen, lol: so for about 4 hrs, about 4 explore/min and got...nothing | [00:41] |
| diana_coman: | loool | [00:41] |
| diana_coman: | there is some throwing a die so far only, lol | [00:41] |
| danielpbarron: | what's nothing? no ordinaries? | [00:41] |
| diana_coman: | no, nothing as in nada | [00:41] |
| diana_coman: | (mining all the time at shrooms) | [00:41] |
| danielpbarron: | oh | [00:42] |
| diana_coman: | otherwise I got about 30 shrooms at least (30 enums) between 0am and 2:30am | [00:43] |
| diana_coman: | so before that awful dry spell | [00:43] |
| diana_coman: | so 2.5 hours in which I got 30 shrooms and then 4 hours in which I just spend the tools :))) | [00:44] |
| Birdman: | gained exp | [00:44] |
| diana_coman: | (this was mining with cruddy hoes from the merchant, if anyone is curious | [00:44] |
| diana_coman: | ) | [00:44] |
| danielpbarron: | ah | [00:44] |
| diana_coman: | well yes, but so far the bot doesn't train that too, as well, not yet that bright | [00:45] |
| diana_coman: | quite curious in fact whether I missed now at least one level or not, lol | [00:45] |
| diana_coman: | (it started freshly trained) | [00:45] |
| Birdman: | ahh so lots of waste | [00:45] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't even need a bot to mine stuff anymore | [00:45] |
| diana_coman: | don't know but in any case, better to leave it on | [00:45] |
| danielpbarron: | i just need a bot that's smart enough to lock and save the key for ordinary and remarkable | [00:45] |
| diana_coman: | oh, how is that danielpbarron? | [00:45] |
| danielpbarron: | and leave all tiny and small claims unmined | [00:45] |
| diana_coman: | that it does surely | [00:45] |
| diana_coman: | why wouldn't you mine those? | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | I don't get it really | [00:46] |
| danielpbarron: | rather have the enumerations | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | esp the tiny | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | oh | [00:46] |
| danielpbarron: | especially the small! | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | do they pay that well ? | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | I can get the bot to make tiny enums | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | like for flotsam and basic stuff | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | for which I don't have a premium | [00:46] |
| diana_coman: | I get lots of them due to high gathering level | [00:47] |
| danielpbarron: | for me i'd actually mine those ones | [00:47] |
| danielpbarron: | but that's because of sortage | [00:47] |
| diana_coman: | but I don't want to mine them due to no storage | [00:47] |
| danielpbarron: | i'd not mine the tiny and small everything else | [00:47] |
| diana_coman: | oh, so quite complementary to what I'd do, lol | [00:47] |
| diana_coman: | so let me know if you actually need tiny or small enums for basic things | [00:48] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll buy your basic harvestable ordinary and remarkable claims | [00:48] |
| diana_coman: | (I still mine the non-basic since I get good quality and it is overall clearly net positive) | [00:48] |
| diana_coman: | mhm, how much? | [00:48] |
| danielpbarron: | i want enums that can be used to make supplications (ask birdman which) | [00:48] |
| Birdman: | or just sell them all to me | [00:48] |
| diana_coman: | (not so sure I'd sell ordinary and remarkable, but will think about it) | [00:48] |
| diana_coman: | so tell me Birdman, what do you pay for each? (tiny basic, tiny rare, small basic, small rare etc) | [00:49] |
| danielpbarron: | i only want the basic harvestable claims | [00:49] |
| Birdman: | i pay a supplication, per ingredients | [00:49] |
| diana_coman: | ? I don't follow | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | im not sure what they would be worth really | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | dan gives ingredients, i give him the product | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | i profit in loot and exp | [00:50] |
| diana_coman: | oh | [00:50] |
| danielpbarron: | 3 small + 17 tiny = 1 supplication | [00:50] |
| danielpbarron: | in the case of leather | [00:50] |
| diana_coman: | I'd give that a go | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | awesome | [00:50] |
| diana_coman: | does it matter what kind of enums? | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | although not sure what you'd do with them | [00:50] |
| danielpbarron: | 1 supplication wants 3 leather and 1 wine | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | yes | [00:50] |
| Birdman: | specific to whichever draft | [00:51] |
| danielpbarron: | sell them to me that's what | [00:51] |
| Birdman: | and some drafts dont even use enums | [00:51] |
| diana_coman: | so what kind of enums do you need, lol? | [00:51] |
| diana_coman: | as if I sell you some that don't match a draft then what do I get in return? lol | [00:51] |
| Birdman: | i could give you a more complete answer when server is back up | [00:51] |
| danielpbarron: | and once i figure out what each one sacrifices to, i'll probably have a similar deal | [00:51] |
| diana_coman: | cool | [00:51] |
| danielpbarron: | bring me supplication + ingredients and get whatever results | [00:51] |
| Birdman: | but right now 3 small leathers and 17 tiny leathers | [00:51] |
| diana_coman: | this was my test run for bot v0.00000001 really, lol | [00:51] |
| diana_coman: | and in terms of "up and running doing its thing" | [00:52] |
| diana_coman: | it worked splendidly really | [00:52] |
| diana_coman: | I prolly even have that in storage allready | [00:52] |
| danielpbarron: | and by whatever results i mean the thing that gets created in the container (not the extra loot) | [00:52] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron you said something about a shop coming soon; what'd you sell? | [00:53] |
| danielpbarron: | clovers soon hopefully | [00:53] |
| diana_coman: | oh, sounds great | [00:53] |
| danielpbarron: | and probably lots of other stuff people want | [00:54] |
| diana_coman: | atm I need to get about 100 shrooms at least | [00:54] |
| diana_coman: | to finish all the oil for mp | [00:54] |
| diana_coman: | but then the very next thing is to start the bot explore the map quite systematically | [00:54] |
| Birdman_: | wonder what the goal is | [00:55] |
| danielpbarron: | i have a gather macro that does a grid | [00:55] |
| diana_coman: | (on this run I kept it tethered to the wm spot as that's what I needed) | [00:55] |
| Birdman_: | to get off the island | [00:55] |
| diana_coman: | to colonise the moon Birdman! :))) | [00:55] |
| danielpbarron: | true crypto spirit | [00:55] |
| Birdman_: | well, i assume the entire game wont be only that island and the moon lol | [00:55] |
| diana_coman: | what distance does that grid cover, danielpbarron? | [00:56] |
| danielpbarron: | i have most of the island mapped out in my mind now | [00:56] |
| diana_coman: | so have you found the clovers and the harlots etc? | [00:56] |
| danielpbarron: | i think i made it go 10 or 12 /explores forward and then sidesteps to a new row | [00:56] |
| danielpbarron: | no | [00:56] |
| diana_coman: | uhm so then the map is not really complete? | [00:57] |
| danielpbarron: | by mapped out i mean that i know the landmarks and how to walk to places without getting lost | [00:57] |
| diana_coman: | or do you mean that all of them are really in the part you don't have mapped so far? | [00:57] |
| diana_coman: | oh, of course | [00:57] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [00:57] |
| diana_coman: | thing is: programmatically, movement is not that precise really, due to how it's done | [00:57] |
| danielpbarron: | mm harlots i would like to get those | [00:57] |
| danielpbarron: | they make ordinary grass cliams | [00:58] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron well, I did auction some of them a few days ago, didn't I? | [00:58] |
| diana_coman: | I think you left them to mp, lol | [00:58] |
| danielpbarron: | i want a lot of them | [00:58] |
| diana_coman: | (he prolly bought them for the same reason) | [00:58] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't want a tiny amount for a crazy price | [00:58] |
| diana_coman: | well, then wish good luck to the bot, lol | [00:59] |
| danielpbarron: | deafeats purpose of mining the claim | [00:59] |
| diana_coman: | mhm | [00:59] |
| danielpbarron: | when i can just save it for the day that harlots are common to find | [00:59] |
| diana_coman: | if you get like 1000k of high q grass out of it, I don't think it defeats any purpose, but anyway | [00:59] |
| danielpbarron: | i have gotten that much out of small claims | [00:59] |
| diana_coman: | sure, it depends on whether you need that grass now or not,lol | [00:59] |
| danielpbarron: | i just like grass because i have sortage | [01:00] |
| diana_coman: | oh, I see | [01:00] |
| danielpbarron: | it's not a "need" | [01:00] |
| diana_coman: | if harlots are find, they will surely drop in price, of course | [01:00] |
| diana_coman: | btw, anyone needs dead molluscs? | [01:01] |
| danielpbarron: | used in ordinary moss | [01:01] |
| danielpbarron: | but i don't want to mine moss | [01:02] |
| danielpbarron: | although i do have 1 ordinary moss claim | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | ordinary moss uses 2 leaf clover too | [01:02] |
| danielpbarron: | maybe you want to buy | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | unfortunately | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | oh danielpbarron tell you what | [01:02] |
| danielpbarron: | or i would trade for ordinary claim of a basic harvestable | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | we might be able to exchange ordinary claims | [01:02] |
| danielpbarron: | :D | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | will give you one for grass | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | and you give me one for moss | [01:02] |
| danielpbarron: | grass or flotsam or anything in that tab | [01:02] |
| diana_coman: | did that with mp earlier but he actually also mined the flotsam for me | [01:03] |
| diana_coman: | mhm | [01:03] |
| danielpbarron: | crumbly rock perhaps | [01:03] |
| diana_coman: | ahahahah lol | [01:03] |
| diana_coman: | crumbly rock has yet to be found as far as I know | [01:03] |
| danielpbarron: | glad that one is "basic harvestable" | [01:03] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, there are really much more basic harvestables, lol | [01:03] |
| danielpbarron: | sortage seems to effect all of those | [01:03] |
| danielpbarron: | i mine quality 275 basic harvestables | [01:03] |
| diana_coman: | yes, it does, didn't I say that like 10 times at least and from the very start? | [01:04] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [01:04] |
| diana_coman: | mp does about 330 | [01:04] |
| diana_coman: | in any case: I'd give you an ord basic for an ord rare in return | [01:05] |
| diana_coman: | just need atm to see which, since for moss I need 2 leaf clovers too | [01:05] |
| diana_coman: | and so right now it doesn't make sense to buy any really, until tlc is either found or you sell some | [01:05] |
| diana_coman: | (I still have my own ord moss enums that I can't mine due to same bottleneck) | [01:06] |
| diana_coman: | do you have any other rare ordinary? | [01:07] |
| diana_coman: | I think wpl also requires tlc | [01:07] |
| danielpbarron: | i have a remarkable something | [01:07] |
| diana_coman: | so dunno, maybe tpt or bbb | [01:07] |
| danielpbarron: | and i should probably get 2:3 or something, what are the odds on these things? | [01:07] |
| diana_coman: | might be worth checking and will give you a remarkable in exchange | [01:07] |
| diana_coman: | what 2:3? | [01:07] |
| diana_coman: | no idea on the odds, lol | [01:08] |
| danielpbarron: | 2 "rare" ordinary claims for 3 common ones | [01:08] |
| diana_coman: | mhm, not sure about that | [01:08] |
| diana_coman: | I might prefer to mine the common ones by myself then | [01:09] |
| diana_coman: | as on one hand I'd get exp | [01:09] |
| diana_coman: | on the other hand I still get quality high enough for some noob to get lots of loot | [01:09] |
| danielpbarron: | is it harder to find an ordinary moss than it is to find an ordinary grass? | [01:10] |
| diana_coman: | + I'll prolly get more ordinary rare ones too | [01:10] |
| diana_coman: | have no idea | [01:10] |
| diana_coman: | I haven't explored for grass in ages | [01:10] |
| danielpbarron: | i think it is | [01:10] |
| danielpbarron: | grass is a tiny every time | [01:10] |
| danielpbarron: | moss isn't | [01:10] |
| diana_coman: | and then again, given that nobody has found cr and that is basic, how is that 2 cr for 1 sm? | [01:10] |
| danielpbarron: | well not that one obviously | [01:10] |
| diana_coman: | that doesn't say anything about chances of ordinary | [01:10] |
| diana_coman: | though | [01:11] |
| danielpbarron: | maybe when a patch of it is found it'll hit for a tiny every /explore | [01:11] |
| diana_coman: | sure, chances of tiny grass are about 10:1 chances of tiny moss | [01:11] |
| danielpbarron: | ditto smalls | [01:11] |
| diana_coman: | doesn't really just translate into same at ordinary | [01:11] |
| diana_coman: | maybe | [01:11] |
| diana_coman: | will have to wait and see | [01:12] |
| danielpbarron: | and it's about 7.5:1 tiny to small | [01:12] |
| danielpbarron: | moss is more uncommon | [01:13] |
| danielpbarron: | the "mining" category | [01:13] |
| danielpbarron: | can expect to get a tiny in a few tries | [01:14] |
| diana_coman: | as I said: haven't mined grass in ages, so I don't really know how it'd go | [01:14] |
| diana_coman: | flotsam certainly goes really well for me if I start exploring for it, though not sure whether in terms of ordinary | [01:14] |
| diana_coman: | I mean: I get tiny in any try and small as you say, about 8:1 if not better | [01:14] |
| diana_coman: | but this doesn't translate in ordinary better just like that | [01:14] |
| danielpbarron: | not necessarily | [01:15] |
| danielpbarron: | but i'm going to assume it does | [01:15] |
| diana_coman: | well, I will not assume that, lol | [01:15] |
| danielpbarron: | until proven otherwise | [01:15] |
| diana_coman: | then we will prolly not be able to trade those until we get data | [01:15] |
| diana_coman: | since our assumptions clash | [01:16] |
| danielpbarron: | so it goes | [01:16] |
| diana_coman: | I guess if I start mining just for enums to sell | [01:16] |
| diana_coman: | I should get data on that quite quickly | [01:17] |
| danielpbarron: | for Birdman_ it's just the enumerations | [01:17] |
| diana_coman: | now it made me curious whether I'd get any flotsam or grass ordinary, lol | [01:17] |
| danielpbarron: | he doesn't need the claim itself | [01:17] |
| danielpbarron: | the claim must necessarily be wasted | [01:17] |
| diana_coman: | yes, I got that | [01:17] |
| diana_coman: | but the thing is that I would then /explore for flotsam and other basic stuff | [01:18] |
| danielpbarron: | yes | [01:18] |
| diana_coman: | for which I haven't really explored in ages now | [01:18] |
| danielpbarron: | and sell me your ordinaries | [01:18] |
| diana_coman: | as I don't have sortage and I would not build the claims then | [01:18] |
| diana_coman: | well, that would be possible only if we get the data to agree on a price it seems | [01:18] |
| danielpbarron: | auction | [01:18] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm sure mp wants em too | [01:19] |
| diana_coman: | otherwise I will either sell them to mp | [01:19] |
| diana_coman: | or auction, yes | [01:19] |
| danielpbarron: | the remarkables are worth a million probably | [01:19] |
| danielpbarron: | "base" value says 300k on mine | [01:19] |
| diana_coman: | or as a backup solution build them myself for exp | [01:19] |
| diana_coman: | clearly so far it seems I'll be a miner whether I want it or not, lol | [01:20] |
| diana_coman: | though a "rare harvestables miner" for lack of sortage | [01:20] |
| diana_coman: | lol, what a miner | [01:20] |
| danielpbarron: | how about this, you bring me ordinary basic harvestable claim and i'll mine it for you and you keep the results (in container + loot) and pay me half of the difference in what the quality would have been | [01:20] |
| diana_coman: | that sounds more like a deal to me | [01:21] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll do same for you with everything not basic | [01:21] |
| diana_coman: | also, what I did with mp earlier was this: I gave him an ordinary sb which he needed | [01:21] |
| diana_coman: | and in return he mined for me an ordinry flotsam (with my bundle) and gave me all he got from it | [01:22] |
| diana_coman: | how does that sound? | [01:22] |
| danielpbarron: | i would keep the flotsam and want the sb though | [01:22] |
| diana_coman: | he built for me the ord flotsam I mean | [01:22] |
| danielpbarron: | both basic | [01:22] |
| diana_coman: | how is that both the flotsam and the sb you mean? lol | [01:23] |
| diana_coman: | yes, both basic | [01:23] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron> i would keep the flotsam and want the sb though | [01:23] |
| diana_coman: | I don't get that ^ | [01:23] |
| danielpbarron: | in that example they are both basic | [01:23] |
| diana_coman: | yes, but what do you mean you'd keep f and want sb too? | [01:23] |
| danielpbarron: | are you saying i mine your flotsam you mine my moss? | [01:23] |
| diana_coman: | mhm, no, I would do that with ordinary only, but I have quite a number of ordinaries | [01:24] |
| diana_coman: | so I might be willing to do that too | [01:24] |
| diana_coman: | if we don't agree to a deal otherwise | [01:24] |
| danielpbarron: | yes ordinary only | [01:24] |
| diana_coman: | though the one you said earlier based on half of the quality diff sounds ok to me | [01:24] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah that's probably easiest | [01:25] |
| danielpbarron: | how is that figured out? | [01:25] |
| diana_coman: | I meant: I would do the same deal I did with mp for basic harvestables only | [01:25] |
| danielpbarron: | is it easiest to take payment in a percentage of the resulting product? | [01:25] |
| diana_coman: | doesn't sound easier to me | [01:25] |
| danielpbarron: | because i don't want to have to peg the product to a certain price | [01:25] |
| diana_coman: | the half quality diff thing sounds easies | [01:25] |
| diana_coman: | easiest | [01:26] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah but does that mean paying copper? | [01:26] |
| danielpbarron: | how much copper? | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | yes, why not? | [01:26] |
| danielpbarron: | how to calculate that? | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | base value + qual, what's the problem? | [01:26] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't trust base value | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | uhm | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | lol, for basic harvestables I do | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | it's what they go for relaly | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | really | [01:26] |
| diana_coman: | did you ever sell or buy grass at some other price? | [01:26] |
| danielpbarron: | you don't even need to know base value if payment is made in the final product | [01:27] |
| diana_coman: | or flotsam for that matter | [01:27] |
| diana_coman: | ugh | [01:27] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm fine will getting a cut of the claim's result based on the improved quality | [01:27] |
| danielpbarron: | fine with* | [01:27] |
| diana_coman: | and how do you calculate the cut to be equivalent to half of the qual diff? | [01:27] |
| diana_coman: | for one thing, at lower qual I'd get more items prolly | [01:28] |
| diana_coman: | I find it getting unnecessarily complex really | [01:28] |
| danielpbarron: | so let's say you would have produced flotsam at quality 150, and mine is quality 250, so the difference is 100 | [01:28] |
| diana_coman: | ok | [01:28] |
| danielpbarron: | and the claim produces 1k | [01:28] |
| diana_coman: | well no | [01:28] |
| danielpbarron: | so that's 1k * 50 | [01:28] |
| diana_coman: | it's not like that, that's the thing | [01:28] |
| diana_coman: | it produced 1k for you given your quality | [01:29] |
| diana_coman: | it would produce 1.5 k for me given my quality | [01:29] |
| danielpbarron: | that's 50k, divided by 250 is 200 | [01:29] |
| danielpbarron: | so my cut would be 200 flotsam quailty 250 | [01:29] |
| diana_coman: | (not exact number there, of course) | [01:29] |
| diana_coman: | that doesn't sound ok to me at all | [01:30] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm just brainstorming | [01:30] |
| diana_coman: | for one thing, the difference is 100, so not sure why did you divide by 250? | [01:31] |
| danielpbarron: | that's the quality of each flotsam | [01:31] |
| danielpbarron: | half the diff is 50, times 1000 units | [01:31] |
| diana_coman: | oh, now I see, I missed the 50 *1k part | [01:31] |
| danielpbarron: | 50k divide by quality per unit | [01:31] |
| diana_coman: | I still don't find this ok due to what I said earlier | [01:32] |
| diana_coman: | in fact it should be 1k*250 as that is indeed what I would get too | [01:32] |
| danielpbarron: | if that were the case, then the difference would be 100 flotsam for me | [01:32] |
| danielpbarron: | if it's true that you would have gotten 1.5k | [01:32] |
| diana_coman: | (I would get it as the result of different factors, but yeah) | [01:33] |
| danielpbarron: | but i don't know that that's even true | [01:33] |
| diana_coman: | look | [01:33] |
| diana_coman: | the qual*count | [01:33] |
| diana_coman: | is what would be a reasonable assumption of what you get | [01:33] |
| diana_coman: | so 1k*250 | [01:33] |
| danielpbarron: | yep, diff is 25k | [01:33] |
| danielpbarron: | in favor of my stack | [01:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | back | [01:34] |
| diana_coman: | thanks mircea_popescu | [01:35] |
| danielpbarron: | Birdman_, ^ | [01:35] |
| diana_coman: | oh wow, upon seeing the game back up it seems that the previous really bad spell reported is just an artefact of a failed tool change sigh | [01:37] |
| danielpbarron: | Birdman_, you left your screens | [01:37] |
| Birdman_: | oh right | [01:37] |
| diana_coman: | still, got 35 mushrooms for about 2.5 hours | [01:38] |
| diana_coman: | so that's actually quite good | [01:38] |
| danielpbarron: | well that makes a lot more sense | [01:39] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron the adjusted calculations being? | [01:39] |
| danielpbarron: | 100 flotsam | [01:39] |
| diana_coman: | yes, it was really odd, but well, I didn't make it spit out *everything* lol | [01:39] |
| danielpbarron: | 10\% | [01:39] |
| diana_coman: | now of course the thing is: why the heck did it fail when it tried to change the tool the 4th time exactly? | [01:40] |
| diana_coman: | geez | [01:40] |
| diana_coman: | arghhh it might be because it ran out of space in inv for the old tool, argggh | [01:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | <danielpbarron> i'll be able to have like a real legit store soon >< :D | [01:44] |
| diana_coman: | not even 1 level in building, sigh | [01:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | <danielpbarron> i'll play poker when it's in eulora << i was actually thinking of having some mini games added. but it'd be... flavoured. | [01:45] |
| diana_coman: | so I have > 50 tiny wpl enums | [01:45] |
| diana_coman: | Birdman_ ^ | [01:46] |
| diana_coman: | and more than 100 tiny moss enums, lol | [01:46] |
| diana_coman: | lol, tinies of pretty much all found stuff | [01:46] |
| diana_coman: | so I guess ping me when back in town | [01:46] |
| Birdman_: | flavoured aye? | [01:47] |
| danielpbarron: | really need the smalls | [01:48] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron I still don't grok how do you go exactly from diff in quality to percentage of items given the link between number of items and qual | [01:49] |
| diana_coman: | lemme see smalls then | [01:49] |
| danielpbarron: | separate thing | [01:49] |
| diana_coman: | (I used to mine those though, so prolly fewer in there) | [01:49] |
| danielpbarron: | exactly, same here | [01:49] |
| diana_coman: | they are not separate, that's the thing (number of items and qual) | [01:50] |
| diana_coman: | well, I have about 15 small bn enums | [01:50] |
| danielpbarron: | no i mean the small claims are for birdman | [01:50] |
| diana_coman: | and a few here and there of all the other stuff | [01:50] |
| danielpbarron: | the enums rather | [01:50] |
| diana_coman: | so: Birdman_ ? | [01:50] |
| danielpbarron: | that's separate from our discussion about ordinary claims | [01:50] |
| diana_coman: | yes, of course, lol | [01:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | the one thing i lioke about this mega slag run is that i get a lot of sortage/tinkering | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | there are 2 discussions in parallel | [01:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | the one thing i don't like is of course the 25mn i paid for it | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | ha ha | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | seen my mininig report earlier? | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [01:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | reading through this log | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | I like the 30+ shrooms | [01:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's nuts, eulora log > b-a log | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | I don't like the failed tool change and subsequent burning of 4 hours for not | [01:51] |
| diana_coman: | naught I should say | [01:51] |
| Birdman_: | busy for a bit | [01:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | yo ufound nothing barehanded ? | [01:52] |
| diana_coman: | I left it mining with cruddy hoes + change of tools | [01:52] |
| diana_coman: | it worked fine | [01:52] |
| diana_coman: | until the inv was full of shit | [01:52] |
| danielpbarron: | /explore doesn't work at all if a dull tool is in hand | [01:52] |
| diana_coman: | and therefore it didn't have where to put the old tool | [01:52] |
| diana_coman: | and therefore it failed to change it | [01:52] |
| diana_coman: | yes, but it shouldn't have been! | [01:53] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [01:53] |
| diana_coman: | for the first 2.5 hours it just changed it with a new tool | [01:53] |
| diana_coman: | whenever worn-out | [01:53] |
| diana_coman: | worked perfectly | [01:53] |
| diana_coman: | now I guess next thing is to run it the whole night with bare hands + die and compare the output per hour, lol | [01:53] |
| diana_coman: | though will have only 2.5 hrs of real data for the tool part | [01:54] |
| diana_coman: | might need a bigger delay after die too | [01:54] |
| diana_coman: | ugh | [01:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | this "cut based on final quality" danielpbarron hatched is not actually half bad. might end up a miner standard. | [01:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | so if you mine at 155 and i mine at 310, i would get half the grass i mined off your claim at 310 ? | [01:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | might be a bit much. but still a good basis to set the knobs on | [01:55] |
| diana_coman: | that's the thing: it seems a bit much to me | [01:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | but that part is negotiable. | [01:56] |
| diana_coman: | I don't see why not use the base value | [01:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | once you got a fair platform, finding a fair price is much easier | [01:56] |
| diana_coman: | the thing about half of diff in quality sounds good for sure | [01:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | the real problem is finding an actual fair platform. | [01:56] |
| diana_coman: | as I said from the start | [01:56] |
| diana_coman: | it's the percentage split that I am not so sure about | [01:56] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, I guess I should update my shop and list ordinary enums, lol | [01:57] |
| diana_coman: | or claims rather | [01:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | the thing is this : suppose you mine at 155 and suppose i mine at 310 | [01:57] |
| diana_coman: | the miner by accident | [01:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | how do i know that you would have got the same grass count as i do ? | [01:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | maybe iu get half as many at twice the quality. | [01:57] |
| danielpbarron: | i wasn't asking for half | [01:57] |
| diana_coman: | that was what I said earlier, isn't it? | [01:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | so this techniucally means that actually having noobs mine may be better. | [01:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | you get low qual, which you don't carte, but MORE items, which you do care. | [01:58] |
| danielpbarron: | half the diff in quality times the total number of units divided by the higher quality | [01:58] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron the total number of units is influenced by the higher qual already | [01:59] |
| danielpbarron: | so you say | [01:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | is it ? | [01:59] |
| diana_coman: | well once again: will have to wait to get data on that | [01:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | lots of things to get data on | [01:59] |
| diana_coman: | so far that's how it seems to me based on exp | [01:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | but the "average value of a small" or "average value of an ordinary" woul;d be interesting data points for sure | [02:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | it'd help all this trading them stuff. | [02:00] |
| diana_coman: | sure @ lots of things to get data on | [02:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | btw how's you two handling the monopoly trade danielpbarron ? got anything sizzling on the altar ? | [02:01] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm burning some leather | [02:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | o hey. what's that give ? | [02:01] |
| danielpbarron: | tokens | [02:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | that it ? | [02:01] |
| danielpbarron: | and something in loot | [02:01] |
| danielpbarron: | i need higher quality stuff to burn | [02:02] |
| danielpbarron: | who has the best leather? | [02:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | foxy prolly. | [02:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | or maybe me. 160ish i think i get. | [02:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman so is the oil done ? :D | [02:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | thinks | [02:03] |
| diana_coman: | lolz mircea_popescu next gen bot: mines & crafts in parallel | [02:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | hey danielpbarron if Birdman_ is keeping his booq skill low, how the f are you going to get good overcrafts ? | [02:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | low q bps | [02:04] |
| danielpbarron: | he isn't | [02:04] |
| danielpbarron: | he's ranking up | [02:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | then again i guess they aren't as heavy as imp tool bps or anything | [02:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman what's your situation anyway, got the moss, got half the shrooms or something ? | [02:04] |
| diana_coman: | I think I still get 155q on wpl, but will prolly rank up now with all the building | [02:04] |
| diana_coman: | pretty much, more like 75\% of shrooms now | [02:05] |
| diana_coman: | and got about 60 oil done | [02:05] |
| diana_coman: | already | [02:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | a ok. so like tomorrow, unless it rains where you live | [02:05] |
| diana_coman: | something like that, yes | [02:05] |
| diana_coman: | now I got all into mining it would seem | [02:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | im stuck for ~2500 minutes burning this flotsam | [02:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | hopefully a noob sells me tacks. like i dunno, 200 of them | [02:06] |
| diana_coman: | and updated: http://www.dianacoman.com/Eulora/foxystore.html | [02:10] |
| lobbesbot: | Foxy's Useful Items (at www.dianacoman.com) | [02:10] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron, mircea_popescu see ^ for ordinary claims offer | [02:10] |
| diana_coman: | basic harvestables | [02:10] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu I have 150 studs | [02:12] |
| diana_coman: | base metal studs - I guess that's what you call tacks? | [02:12] |
| Birdman_: | im gonna be boosting | [02:13] |
| Birdman_: | my bouq | [02:13] |
| diana_coman: | the overflow thing is what made the bot fail on changing tools indeed; guess will have to find a safe way of dropping new keys now, sigh | [02:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah | [02:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | put them on your head, dpb style | [02:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman you selling teh studs ? | [02:19] |
| danielpbarron: | ahh crap, my altar is worn out | [02:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | no ?! | [02:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | nobody looted a recipe yet did they. | [02:21] |
| danielpbarron: | well at least i looted a pretty nice stack of something | [02:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | of what ? | [02:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, i guess we know what we're auctioning sunday huh. | [02:22] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah i have a couple things perhaps | [02:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah, im gonna put up another altar + skill package. | [02:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | is what i meant. | [02:23] |
| diana_coman: | yes mircea_popescu I'm selling them, will be back later today if it's not urgent | [02:27] |
| diana_coman: | oh, that sounds good for sunday | [02:28] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu re keys the trouble is not where to put them at all, lol | [02:28] |
| diana_coman: | but rather making sure it's the right key I drop | [02:28] |
| diana_coman: | as i don't want to end up dropping the key of an ordinary or something, lol | [02:28] |
| danielpbarron: | they key always goes into the #1 inventory spot if you always move it afterwards | [02:29] |
| diana_coman: | oh, 5 shrooms already since 10 mins ago | [02:29] |
| diana_coman: | well, that would be an approach sure, but prolly much safer to get the id of the thing and then drop it precisely, regardless of where it mind have ended up in inv | [02:29] |
| diana_coman: | but as a start hack it's not bad danielpbarron, sure | [02:30] |
| danielpbarron: | i move my ordinary and remarkable keys to the bottom of my inventory so that i cannot possibly accidentally throw it away | [02:30] |
| diana_coman: | that's the thing: if I just check that it IS a small/tiny key before I drop it, then I can sleep well, lol | [02:31] |
| diana_coman: | so prolly will go for that rather | [02:31] |
| chetty: | morning | [02:47] |
| diana_coman: | morning chetty | [02:49] |
| diana_coman: | actually started the crafting run for oil mircea_popescu so if it doesn't rain, the whole lot should be ready today in the evening (it's 8am here) | [03:11] |
| diana_coman: | and crash | [03:34] |
| diana_coman: | (I was just getting things out of storage so prolly not me this time) | [03:34] |
| diana_coman: | chetty or mircea_popescu? | [03:37] |
| chetty: | up | [03:48] |
| diana_coman: | thanks chetty | [03:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | <danielpbarron> i move my ordinary and remarkable keys to the bottom of my inventory so that i cannot possibly accidentally throw it away << the same here. | [08:53] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, but that's not worth it automatically: if I get to move ordinary (hence I know what they are) then I can just not dump them lol | [08:58] |
| diana_coman: | oh wow, so the client itself handles the "too fast for messages" thing: //wait for the view to complete loading | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | while(!objView->ContinueLoad()) | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | { | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | csSleep(100); | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | } | [11:46] |
| diana_coman: | brilliant | [11:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | toooldja | [11:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's basically a bad web browser from the 90s. | [11:48] |
| diana_coman: | it hurt to see that, lol | [11:48] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu I have 100 bottles of oil | [11:52] |
| diana_coman: | 150 | [11:52] |
| diana_coman: | sorry | [11:52] |
| diana_coman: | full set, lol | [11:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | a cool. coming over | [11:53] |
| diana_coman: | ok | [11:53] |
| Birdman: | Is anyone around? | [11:56] |
| chetty: | boo | [11:57] |
| diana_coman: | ha ha, boo | [12:01] |
| diana_coman: | anyone wants dead molluscs? | [12:01] |
| chetty: | I like them live, with a little hotsauce | [12:03] |
| diana_coman: | ha ha chetty, eulora's far from that it seems | [12:03] |
| chetty: | one can dream | [12:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | well maybe in time | [12:39] |
| diana_coman: | oh, I even forgot: still have about 30 mushrooms; if anyone wants them, I'll be in game in about 2.5 hours | [12:40] |
| diana_coman: | Birdman, you in game? I got wpl enums for you | [13:20] |
| diana_coman: | wpl = leather, Birdman | [13:27] |
| danielpbarron: | crash | [13:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha | [13:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | back | [13:58] |
| Birdman: | buying all tiny polishied small stone enumerations | [15:54] |
| diana_coman: | what do you give for them? | [16:12] |
| Birdman: | copper | [16:12] |
| Birdman: | are purple snails rare | [16:12] |
| diana_coman: | yes they are | [16:16] |
| Birdman: | nice | [16:16] |
| diana_coman: | and apparently claims are more difficult to get than for wm from what data I have | [16:16] |
| Birdman: | \wm? | [16:17] |
| diana_coman: | (as in: fewer per number of tries) | [16:17] |
| diana_coman: | lol Birdman, go to the wiki and through the list of short names | [16:17] |
| diana_coman: | wm = mushrooms | [16:17] |
| Birdman: | oh wooly mushrooms | [16:17] |
| Birdman: | alright i guess i should look it over | [16:17] |
| diana_coman: | how much do you pay for tiny pss enum? | [16:17] |
| diana_coman: | polished stones... | [16:18] |
| Birdman: | how many of them | [16:18] |
| Birdman: | if you have a ton ill pay 100\% over base | [16:18] |
| diana_coman: | I guess as many as you need as I can tether the bot there and let it get more | [16:18] |
| Birdman: | if few then less | [16:18] |
| diana_coman: | base is shit, no way | [16:18] |
| Birdman: | oh a long term sort of thing | [16:18] |
| Birdman: | ill pay well for a steady supply | [16:18] |
| diana_coman: | base for mining scrolls is very weird | [16:19] |
| Birdman: | ill ask dan what i can get him to pay per leather | [16:19] |
| Birdman: | factor in my costs | [16:19] |
| diana_coman: | the wpl ones were 15 coppers apparently | [16:19] |
| Birdman: | then figure out what to pay you each | [16:19] |
| Birdman: | then we wont worry of base value | [16:19] |
| Birdman: | let me talk to dan quick | [16:19] |
| danielpbarron: | i need to get a new altar | [16:19] |
| diana_coman: | which is laughable given that 1 wpl I get from that even after taking away cost of 1 bit of nothing and of tool decay still gets to way more than 15 c | [16:20] |
| diana_coman: | sure, I'm not in a hurry at all anyway | [16:20] |
| danielpbarron: | it's not worth the cost of a try necessarily | [16:20] |
| danielpbarron: | because each try had a chance of getting you | [16:20] |
| diana_coman: | atm my first priority is to figure out a reliable way of getting the bot to map the whole thing rather than just tie it up in one spot really | [16:20] |
| diana_coman: | but pss I get quite ok so I can spare some time to do that too | [16:21] |
| danielpbarron: | but i think it should be more profitable to sell an enumeration than to mine it in the case of tiny and small | [16:21] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron everything you do in eulora has a chance of maxint | [16:21] |
| danielpbarron: | it should be the aim of the advanced gatherer to find ordinary and above | [16:21] |
| diana_coman: | well, if it's not, then why the hell would one sell it at all? lol | [16:22] |
| danielpbarron: | because it takes time to mine it | [16:22] |
| diana_coman: | neah, don't care | [16:22] |
| danielpbarron: | the tinies especially | [16:22] |
| diana_coman: | when I sleep, it doesn't take my time, lol | [16:22] |
| danielpbarron: | it reduces the number of ordinaries found per unit of time | [16:22] |
| danielpbarron: | because that was time you could have been spending on a new /explore | [16:22] |
| danielpbarron: | so tinies are obviously more valuable saved than mined | [16:23] |
| danielpbarron: | the smalls you have to also save in order for the tiny enumerations to sell | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | well, if there is a reasonable market for them | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | big if | [16:23] |
| danielpbarron: | because the supplications require some of both | [16:23] |
| danielpbarron: | so i would wager that smalls are worth mining, but you have to at least save enough to pair with the tinies you save | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | precisely: lots of complications for me and it has to be worth it for me to bother | [16:23] |
| diana_coman: | well then again | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | see the case of hanbot with her big finds from tiny claims | [16:24] |
| danielpbarron: | there is a market for them i assure you | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | it's not that straightforward | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | an ordinary costs a lot to build | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | a tiny costs very little | [16:24] |
| danielpbarron: | it will feel weird at first, but tiny and small enumerations are much better spent unmined | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | and if you build a ton of them you might actually be better off | [16:24] |
| diana_coman: | than in your scenario that you lost x ordinaries per unit of time due to building tinies | [16:24] |
| danielpbarron: | and the tiny enumerations can be converted | [16:25] |
| diana_coman: | it might be as you say, don't have the data to say it's not, but it might not be | [16:25] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron so you say | [16:25] |
| diana_coman: | I don't buy it just on your say so, sorry | [16:25] |
| danielpbarron: | well anyway i'm buying them Birdman's buying them | [16:25] |
| diana_coman: | so I'm asking: what do you pay for them? | [16:25] |
| danielpbarron: | depends on which one | [16:25] |
| diana_coman: | geez, start with the pss since that is what Birdman just asked for | [16:26] |
| diana_coman: | (and no, it's not about "feeling weird" lol, what bullshit is that - I got just a bit earlier today some wpl claims for Birdman) | [16:26] |
| diana_coman: | (some wpl enums I should say) | [16:27] |
| Birdman: | Well lets figure this out | [16:29] |
| Birdman: | what are you willing to pay for a supplication of stone dan | [16:29] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't know yet | [16:29] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [16:29] |
| Birdman: | I dont know what else i could base a price off of for her enums | [16:29] |
| danielpbarron: | i will be providing you with the ingredients to make each one in exchange for the result if that's alright | [16:30] |
| diana_coman: | btw danielpbarron are you currently buying suppl of leather drafts? | [16:30] |
| Birdman: | well you have nothing for me to make | [16:30] |
| danielpbarron: | yes | [16:30] |
| Birdman: | she has access to the enums i need | [16:30] |
| diana_coman: | what do you give for those drafts? | [16:30] |
| diana_coman: | you can wait until I get enough data to attempt to figure out a price based on that | [16:30] |
| diana_coman: | that's also an option | [16:31] |
| danielpbarron: | 1 million for 1k of them | [16:31] |
| diana_coman: | 1 mill for 1k suppl of leather drafts? | [16:31] |
| danielpbarron: | ya | [16:31] |
| danielpbarron: | jurov, ping | [16:31] |
| jurov: | e? | [16:32] |
| danielpbarron: | i will need to buy some coppers | [16:32] |
| diana_coman: | so 1k per draft, provided it's a set of 1k, isn't that clearer? lol | [16:32] |
| danielpbarron: | sure | [16:32] |
| danielpbarron: | oh i should say, high quality | [16:32] |
| danielpbarron: | 100 or more | [16:32] |
| diana_coman: | I'll need to get back to the village and check some things to see if that makes any sense at all to me | [16:32] |
| diana_coman: | and will let you know | [16:33] |
| diana_coman: | what quality do you get Birdman? | [16:33] |
| danielpbarron: | also check if you have pacadamia nuts | [16:33] |
| diana_coman: | I do, though not many | [16:33] |
| danielpbarron: | 4? | [16:33] |
| diana_coman: | sounds like some number I might have, yes | [16:33] |
| diana_coman: | but those oh dear me, lol | [16:33] |
| diana_coman: | mp wants them too and I haven't seen any at all | [16:34] |
| danielpbarron: | maybe i have one and only need 3 | [16:34] |
| Birdman: | danielpbarron: http://pastebin.com/rpgAMj2F | [16:34] |
| lobbesbot: | Supplication of Leather: 17 Tiny WPL enumerations; 3 Small WPL enumerations Sup - Pastebin.com (at pastebin.com) | [16:34] |
| Birdman: | List of everything i need for my drafts | [16:34] |
| diana_coman: | see Birdman, you could have offered to just *show* me the recipe so that I can add it to the index, but lol | [16:34] |
| diana_coman: | nm | [16:34] |
| Birdman: | I dont get it | [16:35] |
| Birdman: | Oh nvm | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | the index of recipes is created automatically by a script reading the logs spit out by the bot when I read a recipe | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | basically | [16:35] |
| danielpbarron: | you don't need to say what the supplication itself needs | [16:35] |
| danielpbarron: | i already know that | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | but yeah, nvm | [16:35] |
| diana_coman: | anyway: Birdman, what quality do you obtain for the drafts? | [16:36] |
| danielpbarron: | so it's always 3 to 17? | [16:36] |
| diana_coman: | (I'm not in town so I can't check it now) | [16:36] |
| Birdman: | right now 60 till i boost it up | [16:36] |
| Birdman: | no | [16:36] |
| Birdman: | not always | [16:36] |
| Birdman: | look at stone | [16:36] |
| diana_coman: | oh, heard that danielpbarron? | [16:37] |
| diana_coman: | quite a way to go to 100 quality | [16:37] |
| Birdman: | meh | [16:37] |
| diana_coman: | ahahah, bot got stuck into the fountain, lol | [16:37] |
| Birdman: | if i could craft as much as i wanted today it'd probably be up there | [16:38] |
| Birdman: | just have none of the ingredients | [16:38] |
| jurov: | my talk window ended up offscreen somehow :( | [16:38] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, thing is: I'm not going to *pay* myself for your levelling up | [16:38] |
| danielpbarron: | thank you jurov | [16:38] |
| Birdman: | what do you mean | [16:39] |
| diana_coman: | that the price for the claims has actually nothing to do with how much daniel is willing to pay for your output since of course he will pay less for lower quality output | [16:39] |
| danielpbarron: | ok i have 1 nut | [16:39] |
| danielpbarron: | so i only need 3 | [16:40] |
| diana_coman: | but what's that have to do with the enums I provide? | [16:40] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll get back to you with a price | [16:40] |
| danielpbarron: | or um, i could get one now for leather | [16:40] |
| diana_coman: | I don't follow, danielpbarron if that was for me | [16:40] |
| diana_coman: | ahaha @ suppl of "mosses" :))) | [16:42] |
| diana_coman: | better moses directly or something | [16:42] |
| danielpbarron: | crashed | [16:42] |
| diana_coman: | supplication of back up ? | [16:43] |
| diana_coman: | chetty or mircea_popescu ^ | [16:43] |
| Birdman: | yeah whats that have to do with the enums you have | [16:43] |
| diana_coman: | well, if you price the enums based on what daniel will pay for your output, then it follows that it has + to expect that you actually make a profit while training is kind of... | [16:44] |
| diana_coman: | fwiw I was 100 in tinkering in the early days and it was still actually NOT breaking even to sell the output | [16:45] |
| diana_coman: | so well | [16:45] |
| diana_coman: | but in any case, do figure out what you want to pay and let me know | [16:45] |
| Birdman: | heh | [16:45] |
| diana_coman: | I'll try on my side to figure out what I am willing to sell them for and will let you know too | [16:45] |
| Birdman: | are you saying i *shouldnt* be profiting while im training? | [16:45] |
| danielpbarron: | ^ correct | [16:46] |
| diana_coman: | pretty much, yes | [16:46] |
| Birdman: | if i can figure out how to i will of course | [16:46] |
| Birdman: | but saying i shouldnt arbitrarily is a different story | [16:47] |
| diana_coman: | it is a true story though, lol | [16:47] |
| diana_coman: | since when did the apprentice make a profit? lol | [16:48] |
| diana_coman: | it's not in the sense that you "shouldn't" if you can, sure | [16:49] |
| Birdman: | anyways, the way i see it is that upon your mining travels you come across tiny enums ill buy them, danielpbarron's point was that you would save money by not using the claims, because you would retain value for the enumerations as well as taking less time to find the more valuable claims, and with the increased supply dan will be able to train his sacrifice so its a win win win | [16:49] |
| diana_coman: | lol the two of you | [16:49] |
| diana_coman: | do read what I said earlier in response to that, will you? | [16:49] |
| diana_coman: | in a nutshell daniel's view *seems* coherent, sure, but it's based on many assumptions that I don't buy atm due to experience so far | [16:52] |
| diana_coman: | I don't outright reject it - it might turn out he's right, sure | [16:52] |
| Birdman: | Right, dont take his word for it | [16:52] |
| diana_coman: | but I will wait and get the data to back it up or to disprove it since the alternative is equally coherent + so far actually backed up by some reported results | [16:53] |
| Birdman: | well really its all dependant on what i'd pay for the enumerations, or what you'd have to charge for you to make it more efficient | [16:54] |
| diana_coman: | indeed | [16:54] |
| diana_coman: | that I can fully agree to | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | i prefer higher quality supplications | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | like very strongly prefer | [16:54] |
| diana_coman: | it's also quite unfortunate I guess that you actually seem to need only rare things, lol | [16:54] |
| danielpbarron: | because apparently the altar doesn't last long | [16:55] |
| Birdman: | well the sup or pps is the easiet | [16:55] |
| diana_coman: | as you'd have a much better case for basic ones | [16:55] |
| diana_coman: | since I don't have sortage | [16:55] |
| Birdman: | just need ctt and tiny pss enums | [16:55] |
| danielpbarron: | some of them i don't want at the moment | [16:56] |
| danielpbarron: | but i do know i want leather and berries | [16:56] |
| Birdman: | right | [16:56] |
| danielpbarron: | i want high quality though | [16:56] |
| Birdman: | and i want my skill boosted, which is why the pss is the easiest to make that happen | [16:57] |
| danielpbarron: | that's on you | [16:57] |
| danielpbarron: | it sounds like you're gonna have to make a bunch that i won't end up buying | [16:57] |
| danielpbarron: | although i'll buy them at a discount just to stockpile | [16:57] |
| danielpbarron: | but i probably won't use your low quality ones | [16:58] |
| danielpbarron: | and you can indeed expect to lose money making them | [16:58] |
| Birdman: | there's a price for everything | [16:58] |
| danielpbarron: | yeah and the price for the altar is very high | [16:58] |
| Birdman: | i have no problem working at a deficit | [16:58] |
| diana_coman: | and to round up the nutshell thing: my view atm is that tiny rare claims actually are quite profitable to build + they still hold the chance of really big strikes (see grenadine's repeated results on this) + ordinaries cost a lot to build (when you can, as many rare ordinaries require all sorts of things we don't even have) | [16:58] |
| Birdman: | just need diana_coman to run the numbers and get back with the price per enum | [16:58] |
| diana_coman: | ok then | [16:59] |
| diana_coman: | will try to do that as soon as I can; atm I have very limited data, but I can still try and have a look at least for started | [17:00] |
| diana_coman: | starters | [17:00] |
| Birdman: | does my tinkering skill level effect the output quality of my sups? | [17:00] |
| diana_coman: | good question | [17:00] |
| danielpbarron: | do you get tinkering points when you do it? | [17:00] |
| Birdman: | im pretty sure you do | [17:00] |
| danielpbarron: | i think it relates | [17:00] |
| danielpbarron: | pretty sure my mcguyvering output depends on my tinkering rank | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | that yes, sure | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | not sure what being ranked up in mcguyvering benefits | [17:01] |
| Birdman: | quality of future things mcguyvered | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | my impression so far is that tinkering is like the basic thing and then the others are specialisations as it were | [17:01] |
| diana_coman: | but well, it's more of an assumption based on very limited exp | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | so does having a higher mcguyver rank effect the quality of your products? | [17:01] |
| danielpbarron: | i'm tempted to say it doesn't | [17:02] |
| diana_coman: | of your mcguyver products and I would guess of loot | [17:02] |
| danielpbarron: | yes maybe it makes better loot | [17:02] |
| danielpbarron: | but i think the quality of my mcguyvering results is the same as my tinkering | [17:02] |
| diana_coman: | but a higher tinkering rank effect I think impacts the quality of your products in all branches | [17:02] |
| danielpbarron: | not all | [17:02] |
| diana_coman: | that's what I meant with tinkering being the basic skill | [17:02] |
| diana_coman: | possibly | [17:02] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't think tinkering effects sacrifice | [17:03] |
| diana_coman: | I guess it depends on whether it's an entirely new branch | [17:03] |
| danielpbarron: | my output on the altar is all very high quality | [17:03] |
| diana_coman: | and sacrifice seems to be | [17:03] |
| Birdman: | all craft branches | [17:03] |
| diana_coman: | sacrifice is actually under faith | [17:03] |
| danielpbarron: | ah that's a good point | [17:03] |
| diana_coman: | so of course, yes, what does it have to do with tinkering? | [17:03] |
| Birdman: | or craft skill lines rather | [17:03] |
| danielpbarron: | so tinkering effects all the stuff in that tab | [17:03] |
| Birdman: | would make sense | [17:03] |
| diana_coman: | that's my current hypothesis | [17:03] |
| danielpbarron: | bouq mcguyver lapidary | [17:03] |
| Birdman: | so i should boost tinkering bouq | [17:04] |
| danielpbarron: | you should not boost tinkering | [17:04] |
| danielpbarron: | let it lag behind | [17:04] |
| Birdman: | why not? | [17:04] |
| danielpbarron: | i think it would get you better loot for longer that way | [17:04] |
| Birdman: | for the sole sake of looting blueprints? | [17:04] |
| Birdman: | think of it like this, i dont have a bot to boost with | [17:04] |
| danielpbarron: | and you also want tinkering low for other skills in that tab you might want to loot in | [17:04] |
| Birdman: | the people ahead of me will just grow a bigger gap despite my efforts | [17:04] |
| danielpbarron: | actually speaking of which, i need to have you try to multiply some mcguyver blueprints | [17:05] |
| Birdman: | there will always be over craft possibility | [17:05] |
| Birdman: | im thinking it will be irrelevant if i boost it for the sake of getting you better q sacrifice sups | [17:05] |
| diana_coman: | birdman I've heard it said by mircea_popescu that "it's not a race" | [17:05] |
| Birdman: | or only profitable | [17:05] |
| diana_coman: | quite curious how many will play it like that actually | [17:06] |
| danielpbarron: | some things are a race | [17:06] |
| danielpbarron: | like first to rank 200 | [17:06] |
| Birdman: | well yes diana_coman, i think in the sense that there will most likely always be people below you to always profit off of | [17:06] |
| Birdman: | and those above you | [17:06] |
| diana_coman: | oh, no, I don't think it's meant that way at all | [17:06] |
| Birdman: | but the amount you can profit will be better with higher levels | [17:06] |
| Birdman: | then why wouldnt it be a race? | [17:06] |
| diana_coman: | and tbh I don't think that people below you in rank are for you to profit off, lol | [17:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | server back | [17:07] |
| Birdman: | well the name of this game is to become the most efficient and profit | [17:07] |
| Birdman: | if im not mistaken? | [17:07] |
| diana_coman: | supplication of back up answered! thanks mircea_popescu | [17:07] |
| diana_coman: | but it's not a one-way thing | [17:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | Birdman it's unclear if that problem even has a stable solution set. it would seem they are not computable in any case | [17:08] |
| diana_coman: | higher-up profits of smaller-down who eat it all up until they get high enough to continue the cycle or something | [17:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | these are very much conjectures at this point | [17:08] |
| diana_coman: | Birdman: did you profit from the initial packs I've sold you? (high quality grass or whatever it was to tinker etc) | [17:09] |
| Birdman: | i forgot what i paid you for that | [17:09] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [17:09] |
| danielpbarron: | down again | [17:09] |
| Birdman: | but i did sell all the ctt to mp | [17:09] |
| diana_coman: | wow, that was too fast for me :))) | [17:09] |
| Birdman: | and got tinkering boosted | [17:09] |
| diana_coman: | so exactly | [17:09] |
| diana_coman: | I'd say you did profit, since otherwise it would have taken you days (more probably weeks) to mine enough grass to even make that much thread and in any case no overcraft | [17:10] |
| diana_coman: | and therefore no loot | [17:10] |
| Birdman: | yeah of course | [17:10] |
| diana_coman: | so do tell me how is that since you were lower hence I was supposedly profiting from you or something | [17:11] |
| diana_coman: | while you were not | [17:11] |
| Birdman: | well my profits weren't in copper | [17:11] |
| Birdman: | they were in time | [17:11] |
| Birdman: | and loot | [17:11] |
| diana_coman: | loot is copper for one thing | [17:11] |
| Birdman: | yes but nowhere near as much | [17:12] |
| diana_coman: | and time well, I'd say it's more precious than copper | [17:12] |
| diana_coman: | since it's really something you can't get more of under any circumstance | [17:12] |
| diana_coman: | no matter what you do | [17:12] |
| Birdman: | yeah | [17:12] |
| diana_coman: | how is that "nowhere near as much"? | [17:12] |
| Birdman: | depending on what i paid you for the grass | [17:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron same thing, too. what are you doing to it ? | [17:12] |
| danielpbarron: | opening my storage | [17:13] |
| Birdman: | the items i generate from loot are all really low quality | [17:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | back. weird. | [17:13] |
| diana_coman: | where did you get those suppl drafts from ? did you buy them from daniel ? | [17:14] |
| Birdman: | how does anyone profit from anything? you provided a good or service i needed and i paid for it | [17:14] |
| Birdman: | with higher levels and exp, you can charge someone who is lower level and exp to provide what they need | [17:14] |
| Birdman: | auction | [17:14] |
| Birdman: | the rest loot generated | [17:14] |
| diana_coman: | so there, lol | [17:15] |
| diana_coman: | so you got a monopol thing out of the whole stuff and you still say you did not profit | [17:15] |
| diana_coman: | really | [17:15] |
| Birdman: | but they're really low quality lol, you would generate them of much higher value | [17:15] |
| Birdman: | dont you have any to generate loot? | [17:15] |
| Birdman: | the drafts that is | [17:15] |
| diana_coman: | well, if I get them for one thing, since it is actually more difficult for me to get loot given higher level | [17:15] |
| Birdman: | yeah | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | I think I have some, that's not the point though | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | my point is that you say "higher up profits from those lower down" as if it were a one-way thing | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | it's not | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | it's a two-way thing | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | very much two-way | [17:16] |
| Birdman: | oh | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | lower-down profits from higher-up | [17:16] |
| Birdman: | well yeah that goes without saying | [17:16] |
| danielpbarron: | i'll have to get another altar before i can quote prices | [17:16] |
| diana_coman: | didn't seem so really, lol | [17:17] |
| Birdman: | i thought you meant you wouldnt profit off the lower down people | [17:17] |
| danielpbarron: | diana_coman, do you want to sell me 3 nuts? | [17:18] |
| diana_coman: | you profit from what you sell, it hasn't much to do with them being lower skill | [17:18] |
| Birdman: | its back down | [17:18] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron, let me go and see how many I have and if I can spare them at all as with the nuts I really don't know | [17:18] |
| danielpbarron: | ugh, it crashed again | [17:18] |
| diana_coman: | ahahaha back down | [17:18] |
| danielpbarron: | mircea_popescu, | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | can you be more specific ? | [17:18] |
| danielpbarron: | this time i trained and wrote down how much copper i had left | [17:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | uh. | [17:19] |
| Birdman: | its crashed every time right after i make my pps bundles | [17:19] |
| danielpbarron: | will be interesting to see if my copper is refunded as i usually have to re-train when this happens | [17:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | how do you make the pps bundlkes ? | [17:19] |
| danielpbarron: | each time i have to walk back to town from the same spot, and then i open my storage | [17:19] |
| Birdman: | put em in the claim and combine the ctt | [17:19] |
| Birdman: | but take out before it extracts | [17:19] |
| danielpbarron: | .. | [17:20] |
| diana_coman: | ahahah | [17:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [17:20] |
| danielpbarron: | don't do that | [17:20] |
| diana_coman: | that's the crash point | [17:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | yoiu know this wears down the tool yes ? | [17:20] |
| danielpbarron: | stabs Birdman | [17:20] |
| Birdman: | which tool? | [17:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, leaving chetty a breadcrumb here. | [17:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | most of these have been fixed but apparently something still left. | [17:20] |
| danielpbarron: | Birdman, it's never in your best interest to stop a craft | [17:20] |
| danielpbarron: | and it can crash the server | [17:20] |
| danielpbarron: | don't make bundles | [17:20] |
| Birdman: | have to | [17:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | backup | [17:20] |
| danielpbarron: | it's unnecessarily less fungible | [17:21] |
| Birdman: | but i think i can use craft table | [17:21] |
| danielpbarron: | no you don't have to | [17:21] |
| diana_coman: | if you want bundles, make them in anything else | [17:21] |
| diana_coman: | like on the craft table | [17:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | shouldn't really crash it, so there is that. it's useful to find hte spots | [17:21] |
| diana_coman: | but in any case, you can just leave it to go on, don't have to interrupt it | [17:21] |
| mircea_popescu: | but once onme was found, not useful to keep doing it past a few times, before chetty had a chance to patch it | [17:21] |
| Birdman: | i need the actual bundles | [17:21] |
| Birdman: | lol | [17:21] |
| danielpbarron: | the bundle can only be used to do one thing; the ingredients that went into it are not limited in this way | [17:21] |
| diana_coman: | so make them in the craft table | [17:21] |
| danielpbarron: | no reason to make bundles before you plan to actually use them | [17:21] |
| Birdman: | yeah i got that now | [17:21] |
| Birdman: | im planning on using them for sup | [17:22] |
| danielpbarron: | so turn them into bundles on your screens | [17:22] |
| danielpbarron: | i don't even understand what you are describing | [17:22] |
| Birdman: | lol dont worry about it dude | [17:22] |
| Birdman: | ive got it under control now | [17:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron actually : i have some remarkable mining claims that want bundles. | [17:24] |
| Birdman: | supplication asks for it too | [17:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | jurov man you gotta make me the eulora chan integration this is hopeless! | [17:25] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu you wanted the nuts too, right? | [17:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | pacademia ? sure, but not at crazy \%s! | [17:25] |
| danielpbarron: | in the crash | [17:25] |
| danielpbarron: | made me pay again and didn't refund from before | [17:25] |
| diana_coman: | no, if I find out I can actually sell any, I'll just auction them | [17:25] |
| diana_coman: | (still a long away from town atm, lol) | [17:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | danielpbarron sorry for your loss! | [17:27] |
| diana_coman: | in any case: I basically take orders for rare items that have been found so far and I currently have about 30 wm if anyone wants them | [17:28] |
| danielpbarron: | gimme a price on 3 nuts | [17:28] |
| diana_coman: | danielpbarron let me get to town, will you? | [17:29] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [17:29] |
| danielpbarron: | base value says 1.5k | [17:30] |
| diana_coman: | I'll end up checking the logs for how much spiron asked for them, at least out of curiosity | [17:32] |
| diana_coman: | (I need to check a bit the mining things to see where /if they are needed for what I have now) | [17:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's spirover | [17:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | <danielpbarron> the smalls you have to also save in order for the tiny enumerations to sell << this is actually an interesting argument | [17:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | i do agree that i don't usually bother with digging the tinies. | [17:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | used to gift them to noobs | [17:35] |
| diana_coman: | manually I used to not dig them either | [17:35] |
| Birdman: | its true for any supplement that needs both, supplement of stones do not | [17:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | incidentally danielpbarron you buying tpt ? | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | but the bot changes things | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | good news is: I can sell the nuts | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | 3 I guess | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | any use for 3 of them? | [17:36] |
| danielpbarron: | yes | [17:36] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu or anyone else? | [17:36] |
| danielpbarron: | mircea_popescu, you have high quality tpt? | [17:37] |
| danielpbarron: | yes i want | [17:37] |
| diana_coman: | I'll auction them starting at 2k per, but will wait for mp to answer since he said he wanted them too | [17:38] |
| danielpbarron: | 2k | [17:38] |
| danielpbarron: | in here or in game? | [17:39] |
| diana_coman: | in game I guess | [17:39] |
| diana_coman: | chetty I'm getting again overweight messages (though only mod this time, none system) although not overweight | [18:28] |
| diana_coman: | not sure what is going on really | [18:28] |
| diana_coman: | I am exploring when this happens | [18:28] |
| diana_coman: | and I am actually not even finding anything | [18:28] |
| diana_coman: | I caught them only because I was checking for that too as it might happen for real when building something | [18:29] |
| diana_coman: | tbh I start thinking that maybe the messages get messed up/sent to the wrong client or something, lol | [18:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | i have low q tpt | [18:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | grenadine dug it out mostly. | [18:32] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu are you crafting overweight in game? | [18:33] |
| diana_coman: | by any chance? as I think that might be why I get those messages when exploring around there | [18:33] |
| diana_coman: | it's the first and only place+ time I got them, lol | [18:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno diana... i only got 30k flotsam in my pockets... | [18:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | should be ok | [18:34] |
| diana_coman: | uhm, then really weird | [18:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol | [18:35] |
| diana_coman: | now really not sure what the heck to do | [18:35] |
| diana_coman: | the bot was normally stopping when overweight | [18:36] |
| diana_coman: | as not much sense in trying to do something it can't | [18:36] |
| diana_coman: | but then with those false overweight messages... | [18:36] |
| diana_coman: | shit | [18:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | scam server lol | [18:36] |
| diana_coman: | indeed, they are even hidden, lol | [18:36] |
| diana_coman: | unrelated and for input: 1 tiny wpl gives me at least 1 wpl selling for 232 at the merchant | [18:37] |
| diana_coman: | input into that is 1 bit of nothing (11c) | [18:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | well + the decay | [18:38] |
| diana_coman: | tool decay and time mined which I will leave aside for the moment (but consider compensated by using base value too) | [18:38] |
| diana_coman: | yes, see ^ | [18:38] |
| diana_coman: | so I guess that 232 would be the very minimum at which I would consider even selling tiny claims of wpl | [18:38] |
| diana_coman: | and actually it makes more sense for noob miners to sell them prolly | [18:39] |
| diana_coman: | don't know really | [18:39] |
| Birdman: | well calculate the cost of the tool for how many uses | [18:39] |
| diana_coman: | (re time mined - not yet enough data for wpl to say anything about it, but tbh I get them quite easily, for instance much easier than wm) | [18:40] |
| Birdman: | figure out number of uses it takes to get the enum | [18:40] |
| diana_coman: | yes Birdman, but have to mine enough for that to make sense, lol | [18:40] |
| Birdman: | probably a small fraction over 1 | [18:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | also figure out the ordinary value of a try etc. | [18:40] |
| diana_coman: | the basic maths involved is clear, yes | [18:40] |
| diana_coman: | exactly | [18:40] |
| diana_coman: | and I need more data for that | [18:40] |
| diana_coman: | can't do it out of 1hr run | [18:40] |
| Birdman: | still dont get why building level goes into it, jst because the harvestable is higher q? | [18:41] |
| diana_coman: | yes | [18:41] |
| Birdman: | the gather skil determines the enums q | [18:41] |
| diana_coman: | true I guess | [18:41] |
| diana_coman: | but ignoring the cases when you get more than 1 out of a tiny | [18:42] |
| diana_coman: | the enum q does not matter basically | [18:42] |
| Birdman: | why not | [18:42] |
| Birdman: | it goes into what im crafting | [18:42] |
| diana_coman: | your output is the same and it depends only on your build skill | [18:42] |
| diana_coman: | lol birdman, yes it matters for you | [18:42] |
| diana_coman: | it doesn't matter at build time for me though | [18:42] |
| Birdman: | right, which means it matters for you lol | [18:42] |
| Birdman: | well yeah i guess not | [18:42] |
| Birdman: | the quality of bit of nothing does | [18:43] |
| diana_coman: | how is that? if it matters for you then it matters for me? did we get married or something? | [18:43] |
| Birdman: | id pay more for higher quality enums | [18:43] |
| Birdman: | or they'd be more desireable | [18:43] |
| diana_coman: | if we don't consider the overcraft on building etc, not even that really matters beyond maybe a few coppers up or donw | [18:43] |
| diana_coman: | that's another three pointed thorn really | [18:44] |
| Birdman: | so if the enums you generate are way better quality that the harvestable, should be taken into consideration | [18:44] |
| diana_coman: | how the hell to price the quality on the enums | [18:44] |
| diana_coman: | what's 1q point worth for you? | [18:45] |
| Birdman: | so you lose the build exp, tool decay, the harvest, the time, and you save the ingredient for building | [18:45] |
| Birdman: | idk | [18:45] |
| diana_coman: | how do you lose build exp? | [18:45] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [18:45] |
| diana_coman: | tool decay no | [18:45] |
| Birdman: | missing out on | [18:45] |
| diana_coman: | you still decay the tool to get the claim in the first place | [18:45] |
| diana_coman: | regardless of whether you build it or not | [18:46] |
| Birdman: | im saying what you are expending | [18:46] |
| Birdman: | you use all that, save a bit of nothign | [18:46] |
| Birdman: | calculate what you lose + your profit margine and charge me that | [18:46] |
| diana_coman: | oh, I think I got what you mean | [18:46] |
| diana_coman: | yes, that's what I was trying to get to somehow though it doesn't seem very straightforward even in this simplified version | [18:47] |
| Birdman: | i think that about sums it up, you are just trying to take this enumeration and make it worth more than it would be used for building | [18:47] |
| diana_coman: | and now I got an ordinary in first try | [18:47] |
| diana_coman: | fuck | [18:47] |
| diana_coman: | lol | [18:47] |
| Birdman: | i might not be thinking of everything you expend though | [18:48] |
| Birdman: | and dans point was you'd find the more valuable claims faster, how much faster could be tested with a length of time using the bot or w/e | [18:51] |
| Birdman: | cause it might not be fast enough to outweigh profits of building smalls | [18:51] |
| Birdman: | but it could be if you sell the enums for the right price | [18:52] |
| diana_coman: | I'm trying to get data as fast as I can but it's not very fast it seems, esp since I'd need to mine wpl prolly or something | [18:52] |
| diana_coman: | lots to do really | [18:52] |
| Birdman: | yeah will take a bit to even get a sample size | [18:53] |
| diana_coman: | that argument with finding them faster really needs data-testing | [18:53] |
| Birdman: | atm my gathering is apparently high enough to give me lots of wpl | [18:53] |
| Birdman: | yeah for sure, couple over night botting sessions | [18:53] |
| diana_coman: | it sounds good, but tbh so far my exp doesn't confirm it at all | [18:53] |
| Birdman: | so im in no rush to at least be able to use my bouq | [18:53] |
| diana_coman: | well yes, if I sort the keys thing | [18:53] |
| diana_coman: | ugh | [18:53] |
| diana_coman: | as otherwise it's about 2.5 hours it can do | [18:53] |
| diana_coman: | wpl seems really quite easy to get | [18:54] |
| Birdman: | question | [18:54] |
| diana_coman: | not to mention that in all this we even assume somehow that the *position* where you mine really does not matter | [18:55] |
| diana_coman: | of which I am not entirely convinced either | [18:56] |
| diana_coman: | daniel's proposition is basically that it doesn't matter where you dig, it's just a matter of how long you do it | [18:56] |
| Birdman: | wait | [18:56] |
| Birdman: | what do you mean | [18:56] |
| diana_coman: | my exp so far kind of tends to disagree with that | [18:56] |
| Birdman: | do you think that where you found an ordinary claim will have one next you dig there? | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | look: there are several places of eps that I know of | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | no | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | not like that | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | in one place I had a hard time every time | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | getting something | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | in another on the other hand I got plenty all the time I went | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | still eps | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | right? | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | it can be nothing really | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | but it might be something to it | [18:57] |
| diana_coman: | and it's not that you'll get another ordinary next to the one you got | [18:58] |
| diana_coman: | but one patch might be richer than another | [18:58] |
| Birdman: | well youd need a big enough sample size and test the specific areas | [18:58] |
| diana_coman: | and maybe giving out ordinaries at higher rate or whatever | [18:58] |
| Birdman: | i get what you mean | [18:58] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, I have what to do for the next month or year even | [18:58] |
| Birdman: | there are some patches of pps i would get lots and others seemed difficulit | [18:58] |
| diana_coman: | that, yes | [18:59] |
| diana_coman: | so then the proposition that time lost on building is dubious | [18:59] |
| Birdman: | and by 'richer' you mean just easier for your skill level? | [18:59] |
| diana_coman: | it's rather I waste time on mining tinies if perhaps they are even rarer there | [19:00] |
| diana_coman: | maybe that, I don't know | [19:00] |
| Birdman: | cauuse i thought like every in had something you could find | [19:00] |
| diana_coman: | maybe it's simply the pool bigger there or whatever, how could I know? | [19:00] |
| Birdman: | not that some patches would just be devoid in spots | [19:00] |
| diana_coman: | yes, in that sense yes | [19:00] |
| diana_coman: | but the odds are not the same everywhere | [19:00] |
| Birdman: | right differing odds not amount to find | [19:01] |
| diana_coman: | yes, not amount and not type even, either | [19:01] |
| Birdman: | maybe it changes | [19:01] |
| diana_coman: | even that could be, yes | [19:01] |
| Birdman: | im getting an insane amount of leather and i never have there before | [19:01] |
| Birdman: | only few levels higher too | [19:01] |
| diana_coman: | maybe that | [19:02] |
| diana_coman: | maybe you are just on a lucky run | [19:02] |
| Birdman: | yeah | [19:02] |
| diana_coman: | a bit earlier I just came to a spot, dug once and got ..ordinary | [19:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | what's insane ? | [19:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | would buy some leather. | [19:03] |
| Birdman: | only keeping enums | [19:06] |
| Birdman: | although can sell you and ordinary | [19:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | what'sd it take ? | [19:06] |
| Birdman: | and im getting some leathers like 14/15 explores | [19:06] |
| Birdman: | 7 clovers 7 crab shells 6 snails abandoned eggs and shiny rock | [19:07] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, ordinary leathers are shit | [19:07] |
| Birdman: | payout is crap compared to material cost? | [19:07] |
| diana_coman: | mircea_popescu I even have some lower q wpl if you want them | [19:07] |
| diana_coman: | I was asking in game a bit earlier and thought you didn't need any | [19:07] |
| diana_coman: | no, it's just that they require the clover | [19:08] |
| diana_coman: | which we don't have | [19:08] |
| diana_coman: | hence atm not very useful | [19:08] |
| Birdman: | yeah | [19:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | Birdman i have no clover, so that's that. | [19:08] |
| Birdman: | me neither and i dont need the leathers lol | [19:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman wondering if to make wineskins or imp tools | [19:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | how much leather you got ? | [19:09] |
| diana_coman: | 1 sec, let me go and check | [19:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | i sold danielpbarron a ton of almost wine, no idea if he burned it up or not yet | [19:09] |
| Birdman: | id buy some of that | [19:09] |
| Birdman: | and spicy moss/enums | [19:09] |
| diana_coman: | 71 left | [19:10] |
| diana_coman: | make that 90 actually (just got some on me, lol) | [19:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah i guess so. | [19:11] |
| diana_coman: | I'd buy some imp tools, though not really a ton if it's at 140\% | [19:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | im out, danielpbarron bought the lot. | [19:11] |
| diana_coman: | no trouble with that | [19:11] |
| Birdman: | thought maybe dual wielding tools would do something | [19:15] |
| Birdman: | what is the base value calculated from? | [19:19] |
| Birdman: | or is that unknown | [19:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | merchant price adjusted fgor quality | [19:20] |
| diana_coman: | curious Birdman: at that place of insane wpl amounts what ratio tiny:small did you get? | [19:24] |
| Birdman: | 131/14 | [19:25] |
| Birdman: | and 145/3 on ordinary | [19:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | you got 3 ordinaries in 145 tries ? | [19:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | and 14 smalls ie 1 in 10 ? | [19:26] |
| diana_coman: | sounds like what I am experiencing there, yes | [19:26] |
| Birdman: | More often than normal? | [19:26] |
| diana_coman: | ratio of small rather small compared to what I got when I did the run for your enums a bit earlier | [19:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | seems pretty decent. | [19:27] |
| mircea_popescu: | whats this, electron's hoes ? | [19:27] |
| diana_coman: | quite good for ordinary really, quite strange on small | [19:27] |
| Birdman: | smaller for strange? | [19:27] |
| Birdman: | wow | [19:27] |
| diana_coman: | earlier I had the smalls all ,but I had to get most older tiny from storage for you, lol | [19:28] |
| Birdman: | ahem, its it smaller than normal on the smalls? | [19:28] |
| Birdman: | oh lucky you lol | [19:28] |
| diana_coman: | I got there more like 1:7, but not here or now | [19:28] |
| diana_coman: | that's why I was curious | [19:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | i would guess i get about 1:7 or 8 on average. | [19:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | smalls i mean | [19:29] |
| diana_coman: | (btw: will let it mine this night without build, since I need data points for that too) | [19:29] |
| diana_coman: | do you prefer something other than wpl? | [19:29] |
| diana_coman: | or should I let it go on wpl? | [19:29] |
| diana_coman: | yeah, that was what seemed usual to me too, hence my surprise at this spot which on one hand gives me one ordinary just like that | [19:29] |
| diana_coman: | and on the other messes up the ratio tiny:small | [19:30] |
| diana_coman: | but whatever, not really exploed enough to say if it's not just an artefact | [19:30] |
| Birdman: | yeah the wpl is fine | [19:30] |
| diana_coman: | ok | [19:31] |
| Birdman: | does the quality of the tool effect your exp gained? | [19:41] |
| Birdman: | or do different claims give different, or any, exp when found? | [19:42] |
| diana_coman: | as in what quality the tool has when you start? | [19:47] |
| diana_coman: | or as in imp vs basic? | [19:47] |
| Birdman: | imp vs basic | [19:48] |
| Birdman: | or maybe im asking what do you get gathering exp from | [19:49] |
| diana_coman: | I would say yes | [20:00] |
| diana_coman: | from what you put in | [20:01] |
| diana_coman: | and you wear down more from imp | [20:01] |
| diana_coman: | so more exp | [20:01] |
| diana_coman: | basically | [20:01] |
| diana_coman: | this is quite very clear if you use a chetty stick for instance | [20:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | sticks go 5-6 to tyhe skill for me atm | [20:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | whereas tools maybe even 1k hits | [20:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | and in a sense, since the tool weardown for 1 level is easily 2-3 hours, whereas from the stick maybe 1, should be more valuable also. | [20:03] |
| Birdman: | damn | [20:05] |
| Birdman: | i gotta get some of those | [20:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | you done the ppb yet ? | [20:05] |
| Birdman: | not yet | [20:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | well you're not getting more sb at this rate, and definitely no sticks. | [20:07] |
| Birdman: | i was under the impression i was at my leisure to do this | [20:08] |
| Birdman: | considering i paid for the sb | [20:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | sure. but i can't make the sticks without ppb, and i'm not going to direct more sb to you if you choke the process. | [20:09] |
| Birdman: | ah i see | [20:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | limited leisure | [20:09] |
| Birdman: | i can crank some out | [20:10] |
| Birdman: | how much does a chetty stick cost? | [20:24] |
| Birdman: | i have one at 4k quality if you can put that to any use | [20:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | well they can't be used to mine under 20k but i use lower q ones to average it out | [20:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | so i'd buy that one too. | [20:32] |
| Birdman: | thats what i figured | [20:37] |
| Birdman: | also buying any ctt | [20:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | what's that ? | [20:58] |
| danielpbarron: | is buying high quality crab shells, purple snails, abandoned eggs | [21:03] |
| Birdman: | cft* | [21:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | ah, sadly no cft, out of grass. | [21:17] |
| danielpbarron: | http://danielpbarron.com/eulora/shop.txt | [21:54] |
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